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 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-02-01 02:34:56
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Asura.Sechs said: »
He even recovered to 100% with hate completely reset as we recovered on the border of the Arena, and the Intimidation was still there.
Umm you just collaborated his information.

Uses nullification and no buffs = shield and intimidation effect
Uses nullification gets buffs = no shield or intimidation effect
Buffs wear / dispelled = no buffs = shield and intimidation effect

Every time we've blown past the 50 or 75 HP barrier without our GEO running in and getting nullification the result waz shield and horrid intimidation effect. It happens occasionally because our BST, SMN and PUP are all overpowered as ***. 25% of its HP vanishes in seconds if we're not careful.
 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-02-01 02:40:00
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Asura.Sechs said: »
I'm fine if you don't wanna trust us and I won't do anything to convince you otherwise, but he still didn't use Ebullient Nullification at pull for us on our last two attempts, whatever the reason for that may be.

By your own account he did use it at pull with draw in and full dispel. Also he won't draw in an aggroed pull but will draw in someone who is out of range and on the active hate list. Every single run we've done has him doing nullification immediately. But we don't attempt to run away from him at atart either, our GEO just runs straight up to him.
 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-02-01 02:44:12
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Asura.Saevel said: »
Asura.Sechs said: »
He even recovered to 100% with hate completely reset as we recovered on the border of the Arena, and the Intimidation was still there.
Umm you just collaborated his information.
I don't know. Wasn't he talking about the Intimidation effect diminishing in potency eventually over time?

I just said that for us (on our first complete failure attempt) this didn't prove to be true over the course of the 15-20 mins we stayed in the arena the effect remained very strong. So for us no "diminishes over time" effect, altough this might be because he absorbed way too many buffs back then.

On the second attempt we didn't fight long enough to see if the Inti effect would've eventually been reduced with time. For us it stayed exactely the same from application at 92%ish until 75% when he used Ebullient Nullification (absorbing exactely 2 buffs from our Paladin) and the Intimidation+Shield effects went away.

We never had our GEO (or anybody else outside of the PLD) in range during Ebullient nullification.
PLD had exactely 2 buffs on our attempt #2, and 2-3 buffs on our attempt #3 (both were wins for us)
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By clearlyamule 2017-02-01 02:46:22
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Asura.Sechs said: »
clearlyamule said: »
I've noticed that if you allow enough time pass after nullification was used eventually some if not all it's effects wear off. So you see dmg taken/done go down and sometimes shield go up.
Really? We noticed the opposite.
In our mentioned attempt that procced Draw-in + Ebullient (dispelling a gazilion of buffs) we spent like 15-20 mins wiping and recovering multiple times and managed to bring him down to 77% until we gave up.
He even recovered to 100% with hate completely reset as we recovered on the border of the Arena, and the Intimidation was still there.
I even reported that it doesn't go away even if hate/emity are completely reset and monster regens to 100% (a situation that, for instance, resets the "level up" of targets like Albumen)

Maybe our situation was "special" because he absorbed too many buffs, I can't say, but at least in our situation the Intimidation effect didn't got reduced at all throughout those 15-20 mins of fight.


In our second attempt (Intimidation used shortly after pull) too the intimidation didn't seem to get reduced returns. I was spamming spells nonstop and I couldn't complete casting of even a single one.
The only thing that sent the Intimidation Away was at 75% when he used Ebullient Nullification.


Again, not claiming I know exactely the mechanics of Fu, just reporting what we experienced.
Well that's why I said some if not all. I use autos so I largely ignore intimidation. The DT/DD though is very noticeable. Becomes something of an annoyance if I didn't have Fu absorb enough buffs at start or am slow rebuffing to get it to 75% as dmg just keeps getting worse though it's really just going to normal but Fu has babied me into wanting fast fights lol
 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-02-01 02:47:49
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Asura.Saevel said: »
Asura.Sechs said: »
I'm fine if you don't wanna trust us and I won't do anything to convince you otherwise, but he still didn't use Ebullient Nullification at pull for us on our last two attempts, whatever the reason for that may be.

By your own account he did use it at pull with draw in and full dispel.
Yes, I said "on our last two attempts", which were the two wins we got.
He did indeed use Draw-in + Nullification exactely at pull on our first attempt, which ended up in an utter failure :D
We were so decked on buffs, I had SV+CC songs up and lotsa other stuff.

Makes me wonder what happens if Fu absorbs/dispels multiple numbers of the same buffs.
Like Protect V on 3 different targets. Would that count as "one buff" or "three buff" for the matter of the inherent consequences?
Bet it counts as just one, but it would have to be tested.
 Fenrir.Jumeya
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By Fenrir.Jumeya 2017-02-01 07:42:09
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Fu absorbs the buffs, but I suspect they don't stack as only one instance of it gets dispelled. However, the number of buffs he absorbs directly affects the increase in his abilities.

Beyond 10 is foolhardy, and the sweet spot in our experience is between 5 and 7. Usually the tank will give 3 (Shell, Crusade, possible JA) and the geomancer will give 2 (Shell, stoneskin). He will draw in if his target is over 10'.

The stoneskin doesn't seem to be anymore then the amount on a player, so gain 400-500 when he's getting hit for 65k seems irrelevant. If the geo does not get shell promptly, it is quite possible that a -ga IV nuke will kill him (proper idle set and self-cast shell2 is ample). I tend to run out of range if over 7 absorbed just in case.

Bubbles Torp/Frail, entrust vex

The minimum we've killed him as has been PUP GEO WAR RDM. It is probably entirely possible to go PUP GEO COR or RNG for maximum safety.
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By Fenrir.Sathicus 2017-02-01 08:36:05
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With PUP tank there is no limit to the amount of buffs you can safely absorb, I don't know why you'd stop at 10.

BST tank in that fight is the same mechanic with capped 87.5% PDT. I don't think I've ever been in a situation where I've had to reward more than once before it died, regardless of the DD composition.
 Asura.Ladyofhonor
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-02-01 09:03:14
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So could you make my usual setup work for Fu?

PLDorRUN, THF, COR (melee or ranged), GEO, GEO or BRD, WHM

I imagine use indi-vex, shell as only buff on anyone in melee range and just go at it? Or would it absorbing the same shell from multiple people cause it to go too crazy?
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By Odin.Evilsub 2017-02-01 09:25:30
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Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
So could you make my usual setup work for Fu?

PLDorRUN, THF, COR (melee or ranged), GEO, GEO or BRD, WHM

I imagine use indi-vex, shell as only buff on anyone in melee range and just go at it? Or would it absorbing the same shell from multiple people cause it to go too crazy?


Yes your set up can work, I solo DD Fu on occasion as THF. I have the Pld go in with 3 or 4 buffs after the absorb I go in we re buff and go at it. at the next stage I take all buffs of while pld keeps 3 or 4 on and repeat. Usually do this fight in about 5 to 6 minutes with no issues.
 Asura.Ladyofhonor
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-02-01 10:00:02
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Odin.Evilsub said: »
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
So could you make my usual setup work for Fu?

PLDorRUN, THF, COR (melee or ranged), GEO, GEO or BRD, WHM

I imagine use indi-vex, shell as only buff on anyone in melee range and just go at it? Or would it absorbing the same shell from multiple people cause it to go too crazy?


Yes your set up can work, I solo DD Fu on occasion as THF. I have the Pld go in with 3 or 4 buffs after the absorb I go in we re buff and go at it. at the next stage I take all buffs of while pld keeps 3 or 4 on and repeat. Usually do this fight in about 5 to 6 minutes with no issues.

Could I also just run out every time he's going to use the move since he'll still be centered on the tank and won't draw me in?
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By Odin.Evilsub 2017-02-01 10:03:07
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Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
Odin.Evilsub said: »
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
So could you make my usual setup work for Fu?

PLDorRUN, THF, COR (melee or ranged), GEO, GEO or BRD, WHM

I imagine use indi-vex, shell as only buff on anyone in melee range and just go at it? Or would it absorbing the same shell from multiple people cause it to go too crazy?


Yes your set up can work, I solo DD Fu on occasion as THF. I have the Pld go in with 3 or 4 buffs after the absorb I go in we re buff and go at it. at the next stage I take all buffs of while pld keeps 3 or 4 on and repeat. Usually do this fight in about 5 to 6 minutes with no issues.

Could I also just run out every time he's going to use the move since he'll still be centered on the tank and won't draw me in?

Yes this also works, just have the Cor save some TP for a WS to get him down that 1% and you will be fine. either way works. We usually only let him absorb 3 to 4 buffs because we play it on the safe side. If you want to burn faster by all means let him absorb more, but you run the risk of dying pretty quick yourself. Also, we usually see the high intimidation rate when he only absorbs 2 buffs or less, I personal have never seen it when he absorbs 3+ buffs.

Forgot to add, I have never been drawn in as long as the tank has hate.
 Asura.Ladyofhonor
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-02-01 10:22:07
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Odin.Evilsub said: »
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
Odin.Evilsub said: »
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
So could you make my usual setup work for Fu?

PLDorRUN, THF, COR (melee or ranged), GEO, GEO or BRD, WHM

I imagine use indi-vex, shell as only buff on anyone in melee range and just go at it? Or would it absorbing the same shell from multiple people cause it to go too crazy?


Yes your set up can work, I solo DD Fu on occasion as THF. I have the Pld go in with 3 or 4 buffs after the absorb I go in we re buff and go at it. at the next stage I take all buffs of while pld keeps 3 or 4 on and repeat. Usually do this fight in about 5 to 6 minutes with no issues.

Could I also just run out every time he's going to use the move since he'll still be centered on the tank and won't draw me in?

Yes this also works, just have the Cor save some TP for a WS to get him down that 1% and you will be fine. either way works. We usually only let him absorb 3 to 4 buffs because we play it on the safe side. If you want to burn faster by all means let him absorb more, but you run the risk of dying pretty quick yourself. Also, we usually see the high intimidation rate when he only absorbs 2 buffs or less, I personal have never seen it when he absorbs 3+ buffs.

Forgot to add, I have never been drawn in as long as the tank has hate.

If he works like most other NM I can WS him down during a spell/tp move and then run out before he can use his special move. Assuming he doesn't have Kei-like shield that nearly blocks all damage, but that appear to be the case. What is the danger in him absorbing more buffs? TP moves getting stronger? Spells? I got hit by Meteor for 13 damage in my Mageva set with Vex from Kyou last night so...
 Odin.Evilsub
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By Odin.Evilsub 2017-02-01 10:26:26
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Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
Odin.Evilsub said: »
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
Odin.Evilsub said: »
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
So could you make my usual setup work for Fu?

PLDorRUN, THF, COR (melee or ranged), GEO, GEO or BRD, WHM

I imagine use indi-vex, shell as only buff on anyone in melee range and just go at it? Or would it absorbing the same shell from multiple people cause it to go too crazy?


Yes your set up can work, I solo DD Fu on occasion as THF. I have the Pld go in with 3 or 4 buffs after the absorb I go in we re buff and go at it. at the next stage I take all buffs of while pld keeps 3 or 4 on and repeat. Usually do this fight in about 5 to 6 minutes with no issues.

Could I also just run out every time he's going to use the move since he'll still be centered on the tank and won't draw me in?

Yes this also works, just have the Cor save some TP for a WS to get him down that 1% and you will be fine. either way works. We usually only let him absorb 3 to 4 buffs because we play it on the safe side. If you want to burn faster by all means let him absorb more, but you run the risk of dying pretty quick yourself. Also, we usually see the high intimidation rate when he only absorbs 2 buffs or less, I personal have never seen it when he absorbs 3+ buffs.

Forgot to add, I have never been drawn in as long as the tank has hate.

If he works like most other NM I can WS him down during a spell/tp move and then run out before he can use his special move. Assuming he doesn't have Kei-like shield that nearly blocks all damage, but that appear to be the case. What is the danger in him absorbing more buffs? TP moves getting stronger? Spells? I got hit by Meteor for 13 damage in my Mageva set with Vex from Kyou last night so...

The more buffs he absorbs the more damage he does with spells and TP moves. The first time we did him we went in as Pld, Thf, Thf, Smn, Idris Geo, and Whm. He absorbed about 6 to 7 buffs each from myself, the other Thf, Pld and Geo. The first tp move he did wiped everyone in range but the Pld. So from then on we only do 3 or 4 buffs. Like Saevel says though, if you can burn him down fast enough to the next tp move then you shouldn't have issues, but you have to be quick.
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By clearlyamule 2017-02-01 11:00:01
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Fenrir.Sathicus said: »
With PUP tank there is no limit to the amount of buffs you can safely absorb, I don't know why you'd stop at 10.
Somewhat depends on if it's pure tanking or mixing with DDing.

From experience in mostly dt/acc set at 8ish buffs absorbed it's still very trivial even with tp bonus head instead of anwig no repair/dawns necessary. 10ish I start wanting to switch anwig in especially if it curses and have to actually use repair. More than that definitely need repairs and dawns which can be problematic if the auto is also dealing dmg and you don't want the master to accidentally hit a stray nullification. That said this was with rng auto which has about 2/3s the hp of VE and since actually trying to do dmg not really using as many defensive attachments as I could and only 1 light so less regen etc
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By Odin.Evilsub 2017-02-02 10:40:23
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I do not know if this has been stated before about Kin or not, but my group has noticed on the last few runs with him that he is casting spells based on the day, for example on ice day he spams Freeze. This has been beneficial mostly because it allows us to spam even more weapon skills because of the long cast time without risking a healing ws. On our runs he seems to favor these spells over comet, holy, and impact. Anyone else experience this?
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By Asura.Avallon 2017-02-02 10:54:45
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Odin.Evilsub said: »
I do not know if this has been stated before about Kin or not, but my group has noticed on the last few runs with him that he is casting spells based on the day, for example on ice day he spams Freeze. This has been beneficial mostly because it allows us to spam even more weapon skills because of the long cast time without risking a healing ws. On our runs he seems to favor these spells over comet, holy, and impact. Anyone else experience this?

Love the Princess Mononoke avatar btw.

I'm not sure if I've ever paid attention to that specific detail about Kin but we obviously do know not to TP move during his TP moves (or magic if that's what you use).

It's particularly interesting when we Conduit Kin due to healing it periodically during that window.
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By Ragnarok.Jukiro 2017-02-02 10:57:22
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Odin.Evilsub said: »
On our runs he seems to favor these spells over comet, holy, and impact. Anyone else experience this?

This is accurate. He will cast spells based on the day. It's ideal to enter when you will be fighting on darksday. With addle/nocturne, Kin casting impact gives you a huge window for WSing, just have to be careful about making skillchains which will heal him.
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By Asura.Avallon 2017-02-02 11:00:50
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Ragnarok.Jukiro said: »
Odin.Evilsub said: »
On our runs he seems to favor these spells over comet, holy, and impact. Anyone else experience this?

This is accurate. He will cast spells based on the day. It's ideal to enter when you will be fighting on darksday. With addle/nocturne, Kin casting impact gives you a huge window for WSing, just have to be careful about making skillchains which will heal him.

Do you guys actually do that? Time your runs so you're fighting him on Darksday?

Hell, we're good just to coordinate at a specific RL time each day. :D
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By Odin.Evilsub 2017-02-02 11:03:28
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Asura.Avallon said: »
Odin.Evilsub said: »
I do not know if this has been stated before about Kin or not, but my group has noticed on the last few runs with him that he is casting spells based on the day, for example on ice day he spams Freeze. This has been beneficial mostly because it allows us to spam even more weapon skills because of the long cast time without risking a healing ws. On our runs he seems to favor these spells over comet, holy, and impact. Anyone else experience this?

Love the Princess Mononoke avatar btw.

I'm not sure if I've ever paid attention to that specific detail about Kin but we obviously do know not to TP move during his TP moves (or magic if that's what you use).

It's particularly interesting when we Conduit Kin due to healing it periodically during that window.

Hey thanks! one of my favorite movies lol.

We dont time our runs based on the day either, I was just curious if this was dumb luck he was doing this or not.
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By Sylph.Ice 2017-02-02 17:17:26
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Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
So could you make my usual setup work for Fu?

PLDorRUN, THF, COR (melee or ranged), GEO, GEO or BRD, WHM

I imagine use indi-vex, shell as only buff on anyone in melee range and just go at it? Or would it absorbing the same shell from multiple people cause it to go too crazy?

If you really want easy mode on Fu, just let him absorb one buff at 100, 75, 50, 25 and 10. You won't get intimidated and he won't take much more damage, but our kills rarely go above 4 minutes on him. We let Fu only asborb afflatus solace and everyone else fights with no buffs, with the exception of runes/vallation/valiance.

GEO1: Indi-Haste+Geo-Frailty+Entrust Fury.
GEO2: Indi-Precision+Geo-Torpor. Saves Entrust for a 2nd Fury incase the fight takes too long.

Obviously wouldn't buff with the COR or BRD in this strategy. Without Protect/Shell and absorbing only one buff, Fu doesn't really do much damage to tanks or even melee DD from it's AOEs. Nothing that a Curaga can't handle.
 Sylph.Jeanpaul
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By Sylph.Jeanpaul 2017-02-02 17:20:09
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Could manually strip BRD buffs using Mazurka
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By Bahamut.Tychefm 2017-02-06 06:13:29
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Something I don't think I saw openly mentioned is that the 30000 damage weaponskill objective also includes the followup Skillchain.

So on a mage run for example you can do Immanence Distortion > Omniscience > Darkness to complete it handily. (Omniscience with Voidstorm, Obi and also Hairpin+1/ArchonRing will give a huge boost to the followup Darkness SC)
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-02-06 06:25:06
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Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
Or would it absorbing the same shell from multiple people cause it to go too crazy?
I wondered that myself but to my knowledge nobody tested it thoroughfully.

On a hunch I'd dare to say that multiple copies of the same buff that get absorbed, only count as one, but then again without testing we can't tell for sure.
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By Fenrir.Sathicus 2017-02-06 08:55:59
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Bahamut.Tychefm said: »
Something I don't think I saw openly mentioned is that the 30000 damage weaponskill objective also includes the followup Skillchain.

So on a mage run for example you can do Immanence Distortion > Omniscience > Darkness to complete it handily. (Omniscience with Voidstorm, Obi and also Hairpin+1/ArchonRing will give a huge boost to the followup Darkness SC)

SCH SCs dont count at all for anything except for opening up for MB objective.

Edit: I misread your post I guess. Did they ninja fix this or what?
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By Bismarck.Kuroganashi 2017-02-06 09:05:13
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Bahamut.Tychefm said: »
Something I don't think I saw openly mentioned is that the 30000 damage weaponskill objective also includes the followup Skillchain.

So on a mage run for example you can do Immanence Distortion > Omniscience > Darkness to complete it handily. (Omniscience with Voidstorm, Obi and also Hairpin+1/ArchonRing will give a huge boost to the followup Darkness SC)
Good to know.
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By Bahamut.Tychefm 2017-02-06 09:53:38
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Quote:
SCH SCs dont count at all for anything except for opening up for MB objective.

Edit: I misread your post I guess. Did they ninja fix this or what?

SCH SC is just for opening your 3 step ending in Omniscience for 30000 dmg objective. For 6 step objective SCH SCs still don't count.
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By Fenrir.Sathicus 2017-02-06 09:54:30
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Bahamut.Tychefm said: »
Quote:
SCH SCs dont count at all for anything except for opening up for MB objective.

Edit: I misread your post I guess. Did they ninja fix this or what?

SCH SC is just for opening your 3 step ending in Omniscience for 30000 dmg objective. For 6 step objective SCH SCs still don't count.

Oh okay, I understand now. Thanks.
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By clearlyamule 2017-02-06 10:39:32
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Bahamut.Tychefm said: »
Something I don't think I saw openly mentioned is that the 30000 damage weaponskill objective also includes the followup Skillchain.

So on a mage run for example you can do Immanence Distortion > Omniscience > Darkness to complete it handily. (Omniscience with Voidstorm, Obi and also Hairpin+1/ArchonRing will give a huge boost to the followup Darkness SC)
Should point out that while all that darkness stuff will help Omniscience itself which will boost the skillchains base dmg the weather/darkness multipliers are unlikely to further boost the skillchain directly unless the mob has lower resistance to dark than it does ice, earth or water as those have higher priority on which element the lvl 3 darkness can be
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By Bahamut.Tychefm 2017-02-06 11:02:15
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Niche situation:

If you have a BRD, you can usually force the Darkness part with a Threnody.
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2017-02-07 08:25:42
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Omen adjustments:

Quote:
We’ve also got some adjustments coming to omen. Players will be able to select which route they would like to take to the third area, including routes that do not have minibosses. This will allow players to more easily obtain job cards, and I hope you’ll pick a style that best suits your adventuring needs.

Good. No more stupid Gorger for fifteen runs straight.

Also, no changes to the Treasure room or KI requisition. Regarding the former, that "pick three treasure portents" floor is utter rubbish when you consider that two of them nearly almost always contains 2000 gil.
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