Site Improvements

Make it like Mastery Rank and hide the values but show the rankings so people speculate how much each category is worth.

When will you add points for Master Rank, those should be worth more than a REMA.

No?

I mean. It's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more work to get master rank 7 than make a relic, mythic, aeonic, maybe about even with a prime.

The value should be appropriate.

Mastery rank is the most impressive, valuable, effort intensive etc (7+)

Considering I was Rank8 without doing absolutely anything to obtain it, no it's not?
Rank 9 it's taking me forever, but it's hard to give points on this site specifically for Mastery Rank when most/all of the things that give points now are already part of what gives you points for Mastery Rank itself.
Soo... I dunno, would be kinda shtoopeed.

Reporting Mastery Rank in your page without giving points is another story and I support that.

You got rank 8 by not going out of your way to do special things, but you did everything the game had to offer over the course of 20 years to do that.

That's no minor feat. It feels minor cause all you did was play the damn game. But that is a big deal.

Much bigger of a deal than paying 100m to buy a weapon.

(one issue though, is that mastery rank double dips. it counts crafts and levels and master levels and missions et all)

Just like all the rest it should be on a sliding scale. Just like ML's it should adjust people appropriately and equally.

"getting MR7 is so much work"

>>Doing the quests in the RPG is so much work

*** LMAO

Just change the values of everything at random, once a week, every week, keep 'em guessing

Just wanted to mention, for some reason the highest stage of relics are currently giving 45k points, or at least that's what the calculator says.

I know you're constantly rebalancing these right now, but even if they get reduced back to 27k for a relic, which sounds about right, for some reason Empyreans only give 27k right now, and they're much more work than a relic, and depending on your capabilities to burn through Aeonic full clears, can be much more effort than even Aeonics.

Honestly think maxed out Relics should be at 27k and Empyreans and Aeonics should be 36k, or even drop Aeonics down to 27k, I can go either way on what the Aeonics are worth.

Loving the site changes activity, great job.

Spend some time working on Mastery Rank and you'll probably be able to recognize how little overlap there is between Mastery Rank and the FFXIAH ranking system.

Considering the relevance that ML, Job Points (indirectly skills) Craft skills, Key Items and Crafting Shields, I'd dare to say there's quite a lot of overlapping, mate.

Yes of course there is some overlap. But surely you can see how much content is not taken into account. Things like RoE progression, quests, monstrosity, chocobo digging, titles, battle content, fishing, zones/warps. It's a long list of things that aren't counted in the FFXIAH ranking system.

And that's fine, mastery rank doesn't need to count here too. But it's so much extra effort, it's not double counting progress nearly as much as you are implying.


Also are key items listed on this site somewhere?

So we went from "how little overlap" to "some overlap" :-P
Sorry for being an *** lol, but there is quite some overlapping and it's exactly why giving points for Mastery wouldn't be as straightforward as adding "something else", imho it should stay out of the points system but I'd be happy to see it reported.

Only those related to Atmas and Abyssite and Atmacite, around 300ish KIs?
Which is nowhere near enough the whole amount of in-game available KIs, but at the same time I wouldn't say it's something negligible either.

The difference now is this site really rates people on REMA progress and MR ranks people on game progress. Albeit there is a decent amount of overlap those same people would be moved up here equally (Presumed most people with high REMA counts also have a high amount game progress unless they paid for everything) and would be a better representative on ranking people who have done said portion of this game. (MR in game fails in that presumably doesn't count multiple REMA work on its own)

I agree. I think our forum handles should have Mastery Rank in it ...just because.

To be fair, your quote below was the starting point of this discussion:

I don't really care either way, I'm pretty happy that our character pages show it. I just wanted to make the point that Mastery Rank generally is capturing a lot of in-game effort that isn't really valued/rated in the same way as the FFXI rating system.

Do you mind elaborating on the strategy for farming 50k beads that quickly? I'm over here killing dragons like a CHUMP!

Best scenario is 1011 beads every 10 minutes, rotating all three zones.
Realistically you won't manage to get 1011 every time, alas, and it's gonna take more than 10 mins for each dragon.
But yeah, in the absolutely best scase scenario it's 3033 beads very 30 minutes, so ~8hrs just to farm beads.
Then you have to kill everything and there too I think to do all 3 zones, assuming you already have every possible item to convert into Key item to pop (and some of those items aren't exactly always available 24/7 on AH) I'd say ~3 hrs for all 3 zones, including zoning, warping, interacting with the NPC... possible maybe but not exactly realistical.
We're already at ~11hrs.

Which, don't get me wrong, doesn't change much the example Nsane was making when he mentioned 5hrs. His was just an hyperbole where the meaning is "it doesn't take much effort to get one complete aeonic".
I sort of agree with this, but it's a bit more complicated than he assumes, still.


Ultimately I do agree Aeonics shouldn't be worth 36k points each though but 27k and I've already said it in previous posts.
If you ask me Empyreans (most of them, at least) take more effort in time and money than Aeonic do.
It's a different type of "effort" though. Empyreans can be completely soloed, Aeonics can't (unless you have 5 mules, but some of the Reisen Helms and some of the Ru'aun mobs aren't exactly easy to "solo" even with 5 mules, if you ask me)

I want to say its from farming all the NMs at 9 in Reisenjima and rotating through all of them, then passing leader for the next set of pops, etc., until you have 50k beads and not farming the dragons.

Takes about 6/7 radialenses farming just neak with a party, maybe 5 if you're super tryhards.

It's gotten significantly easier to 6box T4 Reisenjima and WoC/Kirin with Aria + Hoxne. I was using MNK Tornado Kick and WAR for Warcry and Shining One/Naegling. The most difficult iirc was Zerde which took like 4 tries but that was just lack of experience.

They definitely shouldn't be worth as much as they are.

Edit: I honestly doubt Aria is even remotely necessary for it, too.

Farm neak with a group @9 rotate the pop spots, Each person needs a pop, kill change leader and rotate pop spots. Takes like 15-20 seconds to kill a neak. Once all players have popped theirs reload on KI. Each kill is 240-251 beads a kill. Enjoy.

Also most players are farming around 30k beads not 50k because you get about 14~20k beads from previous run. Agreed Neak is the fastest way albeit mind numbing. I think we just did a full zi tah to Reisjima helms kill in under 3 hours last week to help people.

I have personally done 50k in less than 3hrs, and have killed all 3 zones in less than 2 hours. There not that bad anymore. Can zerg all of them at this point. And it's 13,313 beads returned to you with capped vorseal for all three zones cleared.

Just my 10 cents

Aeonics are a joke now, they're Relic tier. They're more effort, but essentially no $$$. I'd value them the same

Empy and Mythic are similar, but Mythic are a little more $ AND a little more involved. I'm happy with leaving them above Relic/Aeonic, but with mythic a little more point value to represent that timegate and $ grind

Ergons are weird now... its 1/2 the time it was at base, and with the new campaign that pops up (twice?) a year you can bang out legend coalitions in 1 month... and outside of the coalitions, the grind is really tame compared to empy/mythic. I think they should be Empy value or lower frankly... the difficult/challenge has aged poorly

Primes are the current big chase. Yes they are 0 $$$, but they are 6 month time game Minimum. No other REMA can say they're on that level anymore. In addition, majority of players are not tackling Aminon to get to stage 5, so most stay at stage 4. I think at current stage 3 10k, stage 4 25k, stage 5 50k big jump in value makes sense. Whether it stays EXACTYLY 10/25/50 is up to yall, but my point is that Primes should be the most valuable REMA, so more points than Mythic whom i'd value 2nd most.

Aside from REMA, I think it's dumb to assign ANY points to Lu Shangs NQ... you can buy it on the AH. 3k is FAR too much for an AH purchase. MAYBE if we were assigning 3k points to the "Carpe Diem" title? but that seems like a stretch.
Lu Shang +1 is fair to value low, 5k seems fair... Ebisu and Ebisu +1 are also fine. 10k for farming the 2 rare inside the belly which can be quite the investment if you're unlucky, and then 15k for finishing everything. It's not that difficult especially after you already farmed the Ebisu NQ, so no complaints with it being work 15k.

I like the previous update that brough the final stage of Shield to 50k. Shields are brutal and grindy, and even if someone is rich and wants to speedrun one in a week it sets them back like a billion gil... 50k is fine even if its the same value as a prime.

And finally.... I'm biased here... but not all master trial weapons are worth the same. The final 2-3 in particular are both Rare and BRUTAL. I think its fine to value stuff like the GS at 2.5k, but maybe each master trial weapon you get after the 1st is incrementally more points? 2.5k> 5k> 7.5k> 10k> 20k> 35k> 50k perhaps? Again... I'm biased here, i have them already. I could care less about my score on the site, i'm more concerned with mastery rank tbh (and I wish that in some way reflected point values), but as far as difficult to obtain and effort, the master trial weapons shouldnt all be 2.5k. That's all

I farmed all the dragons for beads (because I was chasing vorseals) so I cant speak to the speed at which you get 50k... But everyone knows Neak farming is far faster than waiting for Domian Invasion

I will however back up the aeonic run clear time... I recently banged out all my missing Aeonics to spend my beads from aforementioned vorseal farming, and its really easy to spend 30mins per zone with the right people and jobs. We were doing like... 12 players? most of the time, but on some occasions 6-8 and still full clearing in 1hr 30 ~ 2hrs (unless a mistake was made that lead to a wipe)

Absolutely agree!
Said the same thing.

I said this some pages ago. Depends on how it checks it.
Does it check if you have the item or not? Dumb.
Does it check if you completed the quest or not? It's okaysh then (it's "just" 3k points anyway).
I think it used to be the first but now it's the latter after the suggestion I made several weeks ago.

Getting 3k points from the quest is ok for me because, yes, you can buy the 10k moat carps as well, or you can bot fish them yourself, but it's still gonna take you days/weeks because you'll never find 10k moat carps available on AH/Bazaar at the same time, and you can't fish more than 200 carps a day.
So if you want to do the quest, it's still a little effort. Since we're talking about "just" 3k points, I think it's fine.

I think we should assign points to AG Shields and Instrument.