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"Gamer steals Virtual Money to pay for real life debts."
Server: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3
By Ifrit.Mrmittens 2009-07-05 12:37:21
Aakura said: Supposedly free healthcare period. I looked up the Canadian healthcare coverage, here's the link.
http://www.amsa.org/studytours/CHS_FactSheet.pdf Eh, we basically get everything emergency related free. If you get a prescription for antibiotics that are for fighting say a flu, you have to pay for the meds. If you break your leg you have to pay for crutches (some hospitals allow you to simply put down a deposit until you return them). For all intents and purposes health care here is awesome.
Server: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-07-05 12:40:02
well, I do think the option of an Aussie living in Toronto is possible.
Thanks for the clarification Mittens.
Plus, having a house is a great long-term investment.
Server: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 80
By Carbuncle.Nightmarelord 2009-07-05 12:47:19
lmao *** epic. i dont blame him.
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Ramuh.Dasva
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2009-07-05 12:48:29
Also getting a house isn't something you do out of the blue probably was already getting it and money was already tight and then son medical... since don't really know who the guy is and only really have his word who knows.
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 916
By Shiva.Xellith 2009-07-05 13:43:13
Kungfuhustle said: some back-water, cousin *** hick town where everyone has two first names...
Yeah, if someone offered me $4k+ for my account, I'd sell it. Then people say "You're RMT, you're RMT, blah blah blah."
I say this to them... I pay for my account, so I do with it what I want. no you pay for the privilage of RENTING an account as long as you follow the pre-established rules which are in the TOS. saying "its my account I do what I want with it" is like saying "I rent an apartment so I can be as loud as I want in it and do anything I want in it!" which is true... as long as you arnt breaking your lease agreement. RMTing in an MMO or many other games is a breach of contract which means you are a wrong.
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Server: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-07-05 13:55:01
wrong or not, I ain't gonna turn down $4k for something virtual, especially if I needed the money.
Like I said, the guy needed the money for his new house and kid's medical bills, I don't think he cared if he was wrong or not since his real life > virtual life.
Ramuh.Dasva
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2009-07-05 14:00:55
Yeah but he made tons of virtual orphans!!! Shame on him
Server: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-07-05 14:18:07
to hell with the orphans!
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Pandemonium.Fawkes
Server: Pandemonium
Game: FFXI
By Pandemonium.Fawkes 2009-07-05 21:34:51
If I could rob a virtual bank and take home $6,300 I'd *** do it; no ifs, buts or maybes. Anyone who turns down that opportunity is stupid. High-five to the guy.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1733
By Asura.Malekith 2009-07-05 22:07:00
I'm just appalled here for one reason... he steals nearly 200 Billion of game currency and all it boiled down to was $6K US? WTf....
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 36553
By Asura.Ludoggy 2009-07-05 22:14:17
Malekith said: I'm just appalled here for one reason... he steals nearly 200 Billion of game currency and all it boiled down to was $6K US? WTf....
Lots of inflation? >.>
Quetzalcoatl.Diveine
Server: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 51
By Quetzalcoatl.Diveine 2009-07-05 22:18:51
Appalled? How? Haven't you gotten those brosale and brogame /tells? lol. Not meaning to advertise them, for I wish they'd all burn in hell and turn to dust, but if you do the math might figure this thief was trying to beat his competition.
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Lakshmi.Rylis
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 129
By Lakshmi.Rylis 2009-07-06 00:20:41
As for paying to play and what that means.. Basically, the ToS in most games says you pay for the right to pay, provided you play by their rules. If you breach the ToS in a matter that crosses legality, they have grounds for prosecution. Otherwise, it's merely their arbitrary rules..
So, saying it's wrong because he breached ToS is a little silly.. Did he agree to it? Of course, but the ToS agreement basically says if you don't follow ToS, you waive the right to bring suit against the company for canceling your right to play..
So, he breached ToS, they canceled his right to play.. End of story, really..
As to whether it's right or wrong... It's a *** game.. That isn't a license to be a douche, or to cause others grief.. I've always tried to be a respectable player and not mess with people, or do anything I wouldn't do in life.. But really, everyone is different.. When weighed against RL issues, it would be nice if my in-game time could translate to making my RL issues easier.. For this guy, they could. It required he do something questionable, but if it was worth it to him, and no one actually got 'hurt' in all of this, so I'm not going to hold it against him..
As to those who are acting like RMTers are despicable low-lifes.. It's not like they're stealing, or killing, or vandalizing.. They're breaking ToS, and at best, annoying you in one of your *** hobbies.. Get over yourself, your game time isn't so important as to wish harm on people who don't make the game exactly as you want it.
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2838
By Shiva.Artemicion 2009-07-06 01:09:55
Kinda *** up he'd resort to this and piss off thousands of players but hell, you do what you gotta do to get through life. It's his cause I admire more so than his ability to steal money. If that 6 grand was spent on white lines going up his nose then I'd disapprove.
Cerberus.Boundsoul
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 320
By Cerberus.Boundsoul 2009-07-06 01:49:07
doing the math, the last brosale /tell i got said $15.79 for a mil. he sold 200 billion credits for $6k. if that was gil, he would have got $3,158,000. at the rate he got, you could by a million credits for $0.03. i can understand his reasons, if my son was sick and had medical bills that i couldn't afford, hell i'd rob a real life bank. and with the math above, i sure as hell would do it for $3mil. and at the same time as sad as it is, if the conversion rate he got was the same on my ffxi server i'd buy a few mil at 3 cents each. hell alot of ppl would. but then i probably wouldn't cuz that much gil floating around would definately break the game.
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Midgardsormr.Sammitch
Server: Midgardsormr
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1353
By Midgardsormr.Sammitch 2009-07-06 13:22:53
You people calling down this guy for giving up his hobby/reputation to keep his family housed and in good health are pretty damn coldhearted. If it came down to a decision between pissing off a bunch of people online and getting banned from a game or making sure my family has a place to live and money to stay, y'know... alive I'm pretty sure I would choose the latter.
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Server: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-07-06 13:30:14
Rylis said: As to those who are acting like RMTers are despicable low-lifes.. It's not like they're stealing, or killing, or vandalizing.. They're breaking ToS, and at best, annoying you in one of your *** hobbies.. Get over yourself, your game time isn't so important as to wish harm on people who don't make the game exactly as you want it.
Just wanted to quote this part just so everyone can understand... And by this point if you STILL don't understand, then go shoot yourself. oh yeah, real life will always be > to in-game life
Cerberus.Radaghast
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 215
By Cerberus.Radaghast 2009-07-06 14:37:41
Kungfuhustle said: some back-water, cousin *** hick town where everyone has two first names...
Yeah, if someone offered me $4k+ for my account, I'd sell it. Then people say "You're RMT, you're RMT, blah blah blah."
I say this to them... I pay for my account, so I do with it what I want. First: Maybe you ought to read ToS more carefully. It's not YOUR account. You are merely leasing it from w/e company made the game. So saying that because you paid your monthly fee you can do w/e you want, is not only inaccurate, but pretty stupid as well. Second: If it was HIS account and HIS items/currency then NP. He gets banned and pays his bills. Unfortuneately he took things that didn't belong to him and proceded to make a real douche out of himself. Got bills? Get a job. Got medical issues? Get another job, or find some insurance. What you don't do is steal from people who trust you not to do so.
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Server: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-07-06 14:41:27
Radaghast said: Kungfuhustle said: some back-water, cousin *** hick town where everyone has two first names...
Yeah, if someone offered me $4k+ for my account, I'd sell it. Then people say "You're RMT, you're RMT, blah blah blah."
I say this to them... I pay for my account, so I do with it what I want. First: Maybe you ought to read ToS more carefully. It's not YOUR account. You are merely leasing it from w/e company made the game. So saying that because you paid your monthly fee you can do w/e you want, is not only inaccurate, but pretty stupid as well. Second: If it was HIS account and HIS items/currency then NP. He gets banned and pays his bills. Unfortuneately he took things that didn't belong to him and proceded to make a real douche out of himself. Got bills? Get a job. Got medical issues? Get another job, or find some insurance. What you don't do is steal from people who trust you not to do so. yeah, cz virtual people who you'll never see come before his sick son.. STFU ***!
Gilgamesh.Alyria
VIP
Server: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13080
By Gilgamesh.Alyria 2009-07-06 14:42:15
Who cares really...
We sign a lease to rent an apartment and we paint it, do whatever we want with it; same for a car too, lease it, put rims, tinted windows etc.
So a guy got fake money and sold it for real money... He's not getting any richer now the public knows. It's a flaw in the game system that's why we have ppl who sell game money in every online multiplayer so far.
Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 107
By Fairy.Winterlight 2009-07-06 14:56:33
Hey Alyria: What does your name in green bold signify?
Fairy.Tbest
Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 5490
By Fairy.Tbest 2009-07-06 14:57:31
That she's a mod.
Bahamut.Rumaha
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10000
By Bahamut.Rumaha 2009-07-06 14:58:53
It really means shes a sexy puerto rican woman
Valefor.Ghuda
Server: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 228
By Valefor.Ghuda 2009-07-06 15:14:31
Kungfuhustle said: thats why I won't marry someone with debt, I don't need the extra ***. for some reason that made me lol, if thats you in your avatar i wouldnt be so picky lmao
Server: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-07-06 15:49:17
yeah, thats my RL avi, and I am picky, cz I'm THAT cool.
Sylph.Jax
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 491
By Sylph.Jax 2009-07-06 16:03:11
Shindo said: No matter the reasons, it still makes him RMT, which means he and his family deserve to be murdered. thats going a little bit too far.
Server: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-07-06 16:05:59
nice avi Jax, and yeah, that IS going too far.
Midgardsormr.Sammitch
Server: Midgardsormr
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1353
By Midgardsormr.Sammitch 2009-07-06 16:13:24
I haven't actually played Eve before, but isn't about 95% of the game seeing how hard you can screw everyone else over? Stealing 200 billion credits and destroying the game economy is part of the game, the only thing that got him b& was selling the currency.
Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 5645
By Fairy.Xxnumbertwoxx 2009-07-06 16:16:32
Sammitch said: I haven't actually played Eve before, but isn't about 95% of the game seeing how hard you can screw everyone else over? Pretty much, at least, according to the friends I have that play the game. There's pirate guilds that exist purely to grief people and rob them of their ***. Totally within the ToS. There's very little that is against the rules in that game, but yeah, I'm sure RMT is the one big one lol
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2838
By Shiva.Artemicion 2009-07-06 16:17:39
Sounds like he picked the right game to hijack money from.
TORONTO, July 2 (Reuters) - Facing real world debts, a trusted figure in a popular online game stole money from the virtual bank he ran and exchanged it for cash through the black market.
It happened in EVE Online, where more than 300,000 subscribers pay $15 a month to play. They gain wealth through hard work, manipulating the market, or killing rivals in a distant future where humans have colonized the stars in an online game similar to World of Warcraft and Second Life.
EBank, EVE's largest player-run financial institution which has thousands of depositors, is at the center of the scandal.
"Basically this character was one of the people that had been running EBank for a while. He took a bunch of (virtual) money out of the bank, and traded it away for real money," said Ned Coker, of the Icelandic company CCP, which developed the game.
The CEO of EBank, a 27-year-old Australian tech worker who identified himself only as Richard and used the online name Ricdic, embezzled about 200 billion interstellar kredits, the game's virtual currency.
He broke the rules of the game by exchanging the stolen virtual funds for $6,300 Australian ($5,100) with players who preferred to buy virtual money rather than earn it playing the game.
"It was a very on the spot decision," the married father of two explained in an interview.
He said a spam email for a black market website that traded online money for real cash popped up on his screen, prompting him to exchange the virtual cash for real money to cover a deposit on his house and expenses related to his son's medical problems.
"I saw that as an avenue that could be taken, and I decided to skim off the top, you could say, to overcome real life (difficulties)."
Word of the theft spread quickly within EVE. Panicked customers started a run on the bank, worried that they would lose the money they had amassed by hunting space pirates or mining asteroids.
Ironically, if Ricdic had merely stolen the online money he could have stayed in the game. But exchanging the virtual cash for real dollars broke the rules and CCP banned Richard's EBank accounts.
"It unbalances the game," Coker said.
Players can only buy virtual money with real money, or use virtual cash to pay for playing time, but they cannot exchange game money for the real thing.
"We have never seen ourselves as gods who make the rules of social interaction," said Eyjolfur Gudmundsson, an economics adviser to CCP. "You are able to lose the things you have created. That's what makes the world interesting."
Ironically, Richard had built a reputation as one of EVE's few trusted players -- a rare commodity in a game where repeatedly blowing up a violator's spaceship was the only way to enforce some contracts.
Asked if he had any regrets about the scam, Richard said he felt he let down his fellow EBank staffers, many of whom he considered friends.
"I'm not proud of it at all, that's why I didn't brag about it. But you know, if I had to do it again, I probably would've chosen the same path based on the same situation," he said.
EBank survived the crisis. But Richard will not be returning to EVE anytime soon.
"At the moment, we've got our hands full," Richard said about his family responsibilities in the real world.
/Sarcasm -.- Glad to know he would repeat his behavior all over again if given the chance.
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