New Games Suck... Or Is It Just Me?

So... I have been increasingly frustrated with new games over years. I feel like so much effort it placed on graphics, lighting, art style, ect and maybe 10% of that effort is placed into gameplay, controls, and story.

My latest purchase was Visions of Mana, which I was pretty excited for. Secret of Mana is in my top 5 all time, I've played Seiken Densetsu 3 translated and while I didn't think it was as good as Secret of Mana, it was still extremely enjoyable. I skipped Trials of Mana since I had already played Seiken Densetsu 3. Vision is just bad. The english voice acting was awful, the characters were bland/generic or just stupid, and I was 3hrs into the game and all I was doing to running 30seconds between CS. Felt like a slightly interactive shitty anime.

Hogwarts Legacy, Visions of Mana, Baldur's Gate 3, Starfield... I felt like all of these super hyped games were absolute duds. Final Fantasy 16 is coming to PC in a few weeks and I'm not sure if I even want to try it anymore. I've heard people say not great things about it.

I know I'm just venting a bit here, but it really sucks being excited for a new game and then the crushing disappointment when it's not fun.

Putting BG3 on that list is pretty hilarious. BG3 is outstanding game in every way including gameplay, controls and story. I would greatly prefer if they made it like bg1 and bg2, so pausable real-time with turn based system in the background, but that's very subjective and I understand their choice of design to be as close to paper RPG as possible.

I actually liked the first Mana remake, and despised the SoM3 remake, for the same reasons mentioned.

I wont play Visions of Mana, but you can see from the cover its focused on younger players. So, i think its natural to not like.

About gaming per se, at first i thought the current generation was kinda weak, but then i figured maybe the problem was me, i was missing the point what really enjoys me.

A load of things maybe the younger me enjoyed dont appeal the same for my current one. But there are things i really enjoy, and looking for it really made most games i decide play spot on about my tastes.

I noticed i enjoy grind. If a game has decent grinding system, with appropriate reward/effort, thats a sure way to get me hooked.

So, the last two games I played, FFXIII and Infinity Strash, while on the story side didnt appeal that much, when it entered the stage of farming, i had hours of fun.

Infinity Strash made ot clear to me the current genre i can potentially hooked is roguelike with any system of character progression. So, im more accurate in finding exactly what i want to play.

As well as skipping any other game that dont provide the same experience. For example, i never could come back to beat Zelda Skyward or Sea of Star, because i felt they both failed to meet my favorite genre.

I also didnt try the other Shin Megami Tensei because they are about the same. Im not even sure if i will try the latest Personas if they keep the same formula of turn based and mostly lvl progression like SMT3 that i played.

Some new games absolutely suck, but I think that if you can't find anything in a spread that wide it might be your own mindset. Could be you're depressed, or you've outgrown gaming, or something like that.

I thought hogwarts legacy was fine, the gameplay was 'good enough' but it was more about the storytelling and the animation and VA were quite good IMO. I haven't played a ton of BG3, but liked what I did play of it and it's pretty universally well received for both the gameplay and the story.

FF16 was more of a movie than a game, the combat is shallow and the customization is too low-stakes. The free win rings are lame, the restarts mid-boss fight, it's just designed for normies. I still enjoyed the experience for what it was[a long movie with a bit of interaction], but definitely can't defend the gameplay.

Do the stories/writing have flaws? Sure. But, if you're calling Secret of Mana a top 5 game, I don't think you're evaluating them objectively. Nothing from the super nintendo era had the depth of storytelling that modern games have. Perhaps you liked them because the slim animations and dialogue caused you to use your imagination more, but if you objectively review the dialogue those games are (literally) decades behind current storytelling.

Edit: Sorry for a half dozen edits, kept thinking of things to add.

I'll stick by my guns that Baulder's Gate 3 was not near as good as everybody says. I didn't enjoy any of it and I am a big fan of BG1 and 2.

I am exactly the same way. It's the main reason I've played FFXI for so long. Sadly, I don't think we will ever get games like that again. People can't watch an entire 15second video these days without moving on to the next one.


Thorny, did you like Final Fantasy 15? If so, would you compare it to 16 for me? I initially didn't like 15 at all when it released. I played it on XB1 and hated it. I later tried it on PC and it was a drastically better game. I actually really liked FF15 in the context they made it, "a FF game for fans and newcomers alike".

not you i tend to play older games too. i don't know whats with the new games maybe because they all look the same because of unreal?
not sure its not very artistic anymore, and they tend to keep copying the last big success game

Going to quote this for emphasis. I think a lot of people from my generation (grew on up the NES/SNES/etc. train, going on 43 here) underestimate how badly this *** up your enjoyment of your hobbies.

For the past 5-10 years almost every game I've tried to start I've gone in with a negative mindset, because that's what I was mired in constantly -- and thus I couldn't really enjoy anything at all. I've always turned down medication, but just got tired of the constant feeling of pointlessness and finally just decided to bite the bullet and give a few a try.

First two failed, but this last one -- holy ***it's sad how badly depression *** with you. I'm actually beyond angry how many years I wasted due to *** up brain chemistry.

Playing games is fun now. I can still analyze the games, but still overall enjoy my experience. FF16, yeah I like the combat system, but like Thorny stated it's shallow. Fun to me, but there's no real depth.

It helps a lot when your mindset isn't constantly "this game is going to be ***because everything is ***and I don't know why I'm wasting my time with this ***."

You are 100% not wrong that in terms of depth and content Secret of Mana is no where near the size of a game that, let's say, Hogwart's Legacy is. That does not make Hogwarts a better game, but I think you explained exactly why that is.

The ability of the human mind and imagination to fill in the gaps is exactly what makes classic games so much more engaging. It's the same reason most people won't go see a movie of a book they read. Your mind creates it's own connection to what you read and you form a mental vision of that content.

This is probably just a product of how good CGI is these days, but it's something game developers should focus on more. If you looked at screenshots of Starfield and Undertale, nobody would ever think that Undertale is the better game, but it is... by A LOT.

I really wish people understood what you said. I actually like Visions of Mana because it's clearly a for kids game and casual. The boss fights and challenges are still fun, but they aren't hard on hardest difficulty.

...which is also how SoM and SD3 were...but people forget...and time flows like a river...

Not one of the games I've mentions have I bought it thinking "this is gonna suck". After so many games where that is the outcome tho, I'm falling into that catagory. I'm tired of wasting money on bad games.

I wouldn't say I'm depressed. It's been a hard year and I've known actual depression for the first time in the past year. I lost my mother to cancer back in January and it's been really hard. I never knew actual depression before that happened and I understand it now much better.

It's not you, it's the games.

Western made games are mostly all trash, cause of hiring practices and social media.

JP games are still pretty good but the games most likely to be influenced by western ideas are also being tainted now, Square Enix for example is a bomb factory these days.

Korea and China are going to be making the bangers in the years to come.

One of the worst parts of Visions of Mana was the voice acting. You can distinctly tell that the voice actors are not in the same room interacting with each other. They are just reading their lines off a script with zero feedback of the other actor's performances. It was so distracting because it was so unnatural.

This goes back to what I said above about game developers need to let the audience use their brains some. Can't have bad acting ruin your game if it's all text the player has to read.

Other countries could be making absolute bangers, but if the translation is lazy produced garbage you'll never know it.

Sorry for your loss. A mother you'll miss is definitely a great way to have avoided depression this late into life.

I think that most games these days are generically bad and poorly executed. The market is ok with making trash so long as everyone else makes trash too. Every once in a while you get people like fromSoftware that clearly don't care what everyone else is doing. For the most part it's just every game company just barely attempting to do slightly better than the last time and then marketing it as the second coming to see how much they can squeeze out. See polevaulter with the current world record for business model.

This is why I have stuck with FFXI so hard. I like it, I still like it, I wish they would just give it a real budget. It's always been a terrible grind, get to it or start complaining about being bored.


Change the voices to japanese. Read in english. See if this makes it better.

Just you

Guess you just don't like video games anymore

Of the ones you mentioned, Starfield was trash sure and a huge letdown, and ff16 is mediocre/middling at best, but BG3 is an incredible experience and visions of mana is a pleasant surprise that is much better than expected of mana series games these days

And hogwarts legacy could have been much more, but is still fine as a love letter for fans of the Harry potter series and probably shouldn't be taken as more than it is

Damn... that sentance makes me realize even more how much she did for me. Thanks for that.

You're welcome and you deserve all the happiness that she brought you because it was a partnership. I'm sure you brought her joy as well.

This is the reason I made this post. We all obviously have something similar in our brains that keeps us playing a 20+ year old game. FFXI is a gem. I do enjoy the faster pace of modern FFXI. They've still managed to keep a grind that is rewarding, but doesn't take an actual year to complete something anymore.

I don't think any video game moments will ever top completing Apocalypse back in the 75s. The culmination of all that work. I picked up my Apoc on NYE during a party at my house and nobody at the party could comprehend why on earth I was so excited about this computer game lol.

bro just wait for suikoden remasters in 2 or 3 months, marvel vs capcom collection and the new Capcom collection + DQ 1 2 3 Remaster

I turned 47 today. Mostly happy to be able to still play and enjoy games, but I do find it hard to really get into newer games too. So now I watch twitch for new releases before buying to help decide if I really want to play it or not. It's not perfect, but can be useful if you tend to impulse buy games hoping they'll be great.

OOT but, aren't you worried you've replaced one problem with another one, that being having to take medication for the rest of your life?

FFXVI is a solid enough game, but may not be what you're looking for. Hard to say, given...


Is far more likely to be the case.

To be fair, at least some of the games listed are widely considered to have missed the mark to some degree... BG3 is certainly not one of them though. It's a fantastic, exemplary entry of its subgenre. Which, of course, doesn't guarantee you'd like it. Different strokes n' all.

May just be something to step back and evaluate what you like and why. It's almost guaranteed that you're holding games (or styles of games) from formative years in impossibly high regard...because that's normal. Music tastes and favorite albums ever likely date back to then too. New stuff probably won't have that impact on you, because you aren't 13 anymore. So, don't expect it to.

Realistically though, there's more media coming out now than ever, and it's only likely to increase. Chances are good that there's a ton of stuff you'd love out there. Maybe not the big name releases, but, there's a lot more than that around.

The key thing is your mentality. Every game has pros and cons. Be a glass half full player. Assuming you're playing games to relax, have fun, be entertained... be that. Enjoy a game for what it is. If it's really just not your thing, fine. Move on. Just, stay focused on seeking out fun. That's how you'll better direction for what other games might do it for you.

I'd say maybe take that mentality and try some new-to-you things, see what sticks. Or start a conversation about what you like in games, see what suggestions come up.

You think new games are bad, try listening to new music!

I have been in a similar situation lately (EDIT: This is a lot longer than I thought it would be, sorry).

I got major sucked into BG3 and dumped a ton of time into it, it's a really well put together game that was a bug ridden mess when it was released and arguably incomplete. That's since been fixed and it's one of the best games I've played that I can remember, BUT it starts slow. The combat and gameplay typical of D&D games is kindof slow to begin with and takes a while to ramp up, most classes start to come on their own around level 5. After that the pace comes together. The storyline kicks off pretty strong near the mid part of Act I as well. I get that the pace can be slow for some still, in that case maybe that style of RPG just isn't for you, but it's one of the most enjoyable games I've played in a long time that wasn't FFXI.

I've enjoyed Last Epoch. I skipped the story basically and went straight to screwing with gear and classes. It's got some depth but it's also not a huge time suck, which I appreciate. I can do something in the game while I'm on lunch or just have a little bit of time. If you like Diablo type RPGs IMO this one is good and it's headed to being even better if you like that style of game. If you don't then you won't like it.

I've flat out had to stop playing FPS games. I was never a huge FPS fan, but I did have some I enjoyed and there are some retro ones that I thought looked good, but I get super motion sick every time I play them. So that part of gaming for me is dead just because I can't handle the motion. I also find them kindof empty feeling a lot of the time.

I've found myself very selective lately though, less due to money and more just due to time. I play a game for 30 min and then just have to ask myself if it's how I want to spend my time. I also just don't have the mental energy at the end of the day to get involved with games that require learning a ton of new gameplay mechanics. I think I liked BG3 so much too because it was turn based, you could take your time figuring it out, and it's near impossible to break your build so badly you have to start over, and I can get up if I need to and not worry about it. In contrast, I tried playing Monster Hunter: World and basically quit because I got tired of a new tutorial popping up every time I did something. I feel like I was supposed to like it and in theory I should, but I just don't have the energy for figuring out the 100 tutorials it shows you after I spend all day reading code and ***.

I also feel like story content in a lot of games has kindof become bland. "Been there done that", get the epic sword, save the world, so on. Very few games have really broken the mold of story content that I thought was unique and engaging. Even BG3 was KINDOF cut and dry but the character stories were unique. It's not unlike watching a movie you can predict everything that happens halfway through and just get bored. It feels like they lack soul, as well. Take games made when we were kids (in no order of some I connected with the most): A Link to the Past, Secret of Mana, Ultimate Underworld, System Shock, Doom, FF7, Xenogears, etc. These games were made by small teams who were passionate about what they were doing. I remember watching a podcast on Ultimate Underworld's development, he said they'd intentionally hire interns because they "didn't know what wasn't feasible" and brought a new creativity to the small team. The moving stars in System Shock as you walk around? The dev that added that worked over the weekend on it despite his boss telling him not to do it, then showed up on Monday with it finished and created a scene. Their entire version control was a sock, they'd pass a literal sock around to determine who could copy code in (not even commit, copy onto a filesystem). One of the severed heads in the game is their boss at Looking Glass. That type of opportunity doesn't exist now when you have so many moving pieces but, while some no doubt are passionate about what they are doing, it's a lot harder for people to put that passion into the end result especially if it's a single person. I think a part of gaming died the more sophisticated development became. Indie games are saving gaming for me for this reason.

All that said, I've had a rough phase of life the last 3 years. I've found my mentality on certain things changed and my priorities shifted. I've become more selective about what I do with my time, but in retrospect I lost interest in a lot of things due to depression. In 2020-2021 I had four family members die in unrelated incidents including my mom and sister, a few months later my son was born with a major health defect and my wife was in serious condition after birth, he almost died on us 4 or 5 times that year also. The whole sequence sent me re-evaluating life and my priorities. I was an avid mountain biker prior to this, I rode 6-7 days per week and, while not mega competitive, I had plans to do events around the world and that all went down the drain as I re-evaluated my priorities (and due to medical issues of my own but that's another story). I was an amateur bladesmith as well and spent a lot of the time I wasn't riding forging, same story, life twisted and I've mostly moved on. These things were causing me more stress and frustration because I was trying to claw at something that I wasn't meant for and fit a square peg into a round hole. Letting go helped me see beyond what I wasn't enjoying and find things I was.

Games are no different. I have come to a place where I ask myself if what I'm doing is worth what time I have and if it's going to bring me more enjoyment or frustration. I've walked away from a lot of things the last 2 years as a result, XI included (mostly). I found myself frustrated by it, but the more time goes on the more I realized I just needed someone to tell me it's ok that those things are in the past and your life is different now. So it's ok if gaming doesn't have the same appeal to you that it did 1, 5, 10, 20 years ago. Life pivots and moves, find something that engages you and keeps you going, it doesn't have to be the same thing that it was before. It's not like these games are going anywhere and you can always revisit it. If you are depressed then getting some help is a good thing, I wish I had, but losing interest in things due to major life changes is ok. It's ok if those 300 games in your queue never get played.

and sorry to hear about your mom. I went through this in 2021. It's rough. I know family dynamics aren't always the same but watching my wife care for my children now makes me realize how much she loved and cared for me. There is a chemical connection there and I miss her every day even though the later years of her life she was difficult. She died from FTD and watching her slow decline is one of the worst things I've had to deal with and probably ever will.

Anyway. Take care of yourself and remember it's ok for life to change and your interests to change. Find what engages you and if something doesn't, it's ok to shift.

That isn't necessarily a given. The general idea is that it helps steer things back to normal levels. Once your brain is used to that again, it may maintain them on its own. And/or you may make lifestyle changes in the meantime that'll help towards that end.

I understand the sentiment though- that was my take for a long time. Doctor ended up putting me on sertraline (Zoloft), which made a noticeable difference. Then after a few years, they had me phase it out and stop. So, from personal experience, meds may just be something to course-correct and get off of. If you feel like they'd help you, definitely consider 'em. I should have earlier.

I've definitely played some good non AAA games. CrossCode was decent, Sea of Stars, Undertale, Legends of Idleon (idle game). There is good games out there, I'm only about 72% some crotchety old miser that's all "back in my day games were better". I just feel like every game I've paid $60+ for in the past lotta years has been terrible.

I'm also not the type of person who doesn't have anything else to do. I design and build things constantly, I play drums and guitar, I work on cars... I'm not in need of new hobbies or "things that stick".

A few people now have mentioned that I'm starting these games with the idea "this is gonna suck". That is absolutely not the case. Even tho I keep getting burned by the last game sucking, I'm still excited for the next new one...


We share a lot of simularities over the past 4 years, but you had it worse. I'm sorry for all you went through. Dimensia is one of the hardest and worst things anybody has to deal with. I am extremely thankful of the course of events (as bad as they were) I went through with my mom. Things were bad, but they could have been worse.

You sound like you grew stronger because of it all and everything you said is great advice. Maybe I have out grown video games, at least modern video games.

I spent a long time depressed, but I beat it by making a habit of self-assessing my behavior with the criteria of:
Is this a healthy choice?
Will this make me better off tomorrow than I am today?

Depression is really just a negative feedback loop, the brain chemistry is reflective of your behavior and the idea that you need medication to get to normal levels has never been supported by credible trials. The only anti-depressants that can be shown to consistantly beat placebos are stimulant based and have severe risk of addiction or worse problems.

Daily exercise, healthy diet, and consistant sleep schedule are supported by the data in every attempt made to measure them. If you really want to beat depression, start working on those habits. I spent a long time thinking that physical and mental health didn't have to be related, and I could be a fat slob and still be happy because intelligence matters more. I absolutely don't believe that any more, if you aren't physically healthy your energy levels motivate your decisions more than you may consciously realize.

But, last time a thread got into this Rooks locked it and implied we were irresponsible for advocating anything without being doctors. So, if you think you're depressed, probably just talk to your doctor.

Didn't play through 15, sorry.

This as simple as it is I think is the most important take away that I've gotten better about recently. Safe to say we all put a lot of thought, effort, time and passion into gaming which makes it bring a lot of joy when it works - or frustration when it doesn't. Shifting my mindset from needing the perfect game I could play for 30mins or 5hrs, had the perfect balance of character building, grinding, story, combat etc. To taking the pressure off and just enjoying what I can, when I can, has made modern games a lot more attractive than they used to be. I've got more options of games to play that are suited for whatever amount of time or mood I'm in - even if none of them are the perfect combo of all 20 specific things I like in one.

It's not just games, it's everything. The world is a soulcrushing place, and having lost the birth lottery, you realize everything gradually sucks more.

It's just the human condition. You just make the best of it. It's not something you fix, you just try to care less about it and muddle through. (Of course you can feel better in a general sense with healthy actions but it will only change your view of things, not the reality of them)

There's no worse or better in situations like this, it's all bad and I don't really feel like what I experienced is any worse than what other people have experienced around me. We're all just kindof trying to find our way through whatever we have.

I guess my point wasn't to look at this like "ugh, I keep playing games and can't find something I connect with" rather view it as an opportunity to explore other things and see the world differently. It makes the other things that much better and when you do find something you connect with, it's that much better.

Maybe as an example, I quit eating refined sugar for a long time. After I did, I found a lot of the crap I used to eat just didn't taste as good, but the good stuff tasted so much better, my taste completely changed for the better. This isn't much different. When I engage with a game now, it feels a lot better than it did when I was playing something just to pass the time. Life for me is better because I've filtered out the crap to instead emphasize what actually has substance.

It can be depressing for a bit, but the day I realized I could let go of clawing at things I was trying to make fit that didn't, it felt like a new world opened up.

Eiryl, have you seen Bill Burr's movie Old Dads? Kind of struck home when I watched it.

I get it man, I share the sentiment about most things. I have learned how incredibly unhealthy it is to go through life with that mentality about everything. It's a legit struggle, but take my word for it... You'll be happier if you don't let that ***stick to you.

I know this is a ironic topic to be saying this in, but I'm still working on myself in this regard. (This thread has turned into a pretty healthy conversation)