Anyone Got A Drg Guide ( Bg Wiki Been Deleted)

I looked into this and the reason he went out of his way to do that is because you were literally copy-pasting the info he had on his guide, which I assume he took a personal distaste to.

Unfortunately I can't do anything because my mod was revoked forever ago because I'm too much of a "good guy" to take a stance against someone he didn't personally like because it "ruined the image of the wiki on the discord" or something.

Once your temp is over, just put in something original instead and you're fine.

The community samurai guide was locked for a while, but it was because someone was replacing every TP/WS set with QA+4 oboro sets on everything, and I kept explaining to them that gambling on black matter augs is not feasible nor easily replicable, so putting in fake "ideal" sets were against the idea of a guide.

I don't know if it still is, because I haven't done any incredibly meaningful updates over the past few years other than small edits where people ask for them at times.

People who didn't play in the 75 era running private servers? I think I'm obligated to hate him.

So. Anyone writing one? Otherwise, another fool like me might write it and it will be hilariously bad.

When I was learning and gearing DRG I used ryan's guide heavily but also Tatang's great little talk page here: https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/User:Tatang which any guide should credit for.

I was on break from ffxi/wiki things but saw in my LS that there was talk and decided to come to the forums, I think I want to provide some perspective on things for my sake more than anything else:

I am a known troublemaker in the wiki discord and in general for people that know me (hi positron xD), I believe genuinely you can ask any editor that had to interact with me know that I will argue infinitely to change things, hopefully in my mind for the better, with some seriously strong language and often inflammatory too just cause I am that way. Not once since 2019 if not earlier I had an issue of anyone giving me hassle for it so for sure your perspective is a tad intense, but also in general in this thread/other discussions.

Admittedly it's a wiki so my stuff has been edited or we discussed if it was good as I edited and it was reworked or deleted but that's part of interacting with other people and taking feedback in the wiki context. You can't edit a wiki of any game an expect it to be the pristine "never-to-be-challenged-changed-deleted" ever. Was I always pleased? No, brahms, posi, spicy, hya, bippin, alexeina, rubenator/martel and all the other can easily vouch I often made some displeasures heard, or I've come headstrong on topics and all but we all got different opinions and that's a good thing. For one example I disagreed with brahms/hya/spicy on merits on SCH and if I really wanted I could've made the SCH guide my own branded one when I first started on it and bar everyone from editing it but I didn't cause for me that's not the point cause I'm not the authority of this game. I literally gave ***to spicy, funk and positron often for a plethora of things and we still got along fine (I think?) cause that's the point of discussing things about the wiki and I've never had any issues besides disagreeing with different opinions. No one barred me from reworking sections of the wiki, even if I sometimes did it poorly and it caused things to need a new rework.

On the bigger topic and other posts I want to say that if anyone is doing any wiki/guide editing ESPECIALLY for ffxi for clout/recognition/thanks you're just an idiot tbh. And I don't mean to insult anyone.

I've edited the wiki in fueled rampages of 10+ hours just to make things better for myself first, my friends in my ls cause I was kinda tired of repeating myself in discord, and then everyone else cause I wanted it as I thought it would keep the game alive and make it better for ME first and secondarily everyone else as I enjoy the game first and people on it a distant second. I don't get a participation prize, no one pays me,I gain nothing but wasting my life on this, I even got lightly harassed for making mistakes and only once someone thanked me and I found myself flustered and not sure I even said anythinng back besides "o.o!" cause I don't think we should expect thanks tbh. If anyone is doing wiki stuff in ffxi or other game for clout/recognition again, not the point imho. I think people severely underestimate how much of a pain in the arse is to do anything related to this game compared to others and how much of a genuine waste of life is to edit information in a presentable way for people that will ***on you for the tiniest mistake. I was lucky not to attract too much ***but I definitely had my moments where I wondered "why the *** do I even login on the wiki?".

I don't super agree with deleting the content on a personal level (I like historical preservation of information) but it is HIS personal content, he can do what he wants with it and I approve of that stance on principle and if I were asked about it I would've agreed with the logic cause again, wiki stuff is not a given for people, it's something people do cause they want and if they want to delete it they can. I've not looked into if anyone's deleted things they were not supposed to but I trust people active in mod/admin have so it just is what it is. As long as other people content has not been attacked I think it's all good for me, a bit sad it had to happen, but y'know, it's not a god given gift to be given a job guide. There's no transaction here, it's people volountarily making online content for other people, that's why I take year long breaks from editing the wiki cause no one is forcing me to be there.

I'm not a fan of people shitting on someone spending time creating things (no matter their attitude, like mine for ex. which I'm well aware is genuinely toxic at times) and then when they decide they had enough, shitting on them for stopping providing said content. It's unsurprising someone would say "well, I'm out and I'm taking my stuff with me" maybe not the most reasonable for some but it's understandable at least.

I think criticism is fair but let's not be the usual selves of "this person is ***, he gave me something free, now I'm entitled to have it forever but he's still ***!!!". It's embarassing by now.

I know I'll get blasted for arguing in favour of the most hated person in this community in this case as it seems but genuinely I think people lack a severe amount of perspective of what it does take for things to be kept alive to this day and not understanding the why one would just say "*** it, you do it then" cause when I started the wiki I had entirely that attitude, started editing, and then realized "oh ***, for me to edit this *** thing it'll take the next week of a full time job and even then I'm not even 10% close to making it good for people to not ***on me all day long". It's not rocket science but it's a thankless time consuming waste of life to just prop a live a game that is teethering on the edge for 5/10 years over thhe brink of death.

I've always been a giant fan of "do it yourself if you think you can do better". If you feel ffxiclopedia is better, nice, get involved make an account start editing. Bgwiki and ffxiclopedia not for you? Start a new one! The community guides not for you since other people can edit? Make your own! I don't think anyone's dissuading you or stopping you are they? Can always make a ffxiah guide, maybe a youtube video.

I think if you see the posts of everyone that actually got involved in keeping this ***alive even once you'll see a common trend (like prothescar post) so I think I've said enough.

Just to be safe since I assume no one has read 1/10th of this:

spicy bad, wiki bad.

But i like spicy food.

Not sure about wiki’s taste, though

I'm just gonna point this out:

As in all things ffxi, this approach can be situational. My team goes 0dt if it's possible to gain more tp back during idle and while getting hit in an Aminon fight.

That's usually just horizon shi**ers shilling their dying server, the sub is fine.

Best Guide

It was the weapon section and only so many ways to say "it comes from blank, it is better than blank" I removed his personal thoughts and opinions, since they were not great to begin with.

That are 2 different things.

If someone is mean to other people then other people are way more likely to be mean too. "Do good things for the world" may offset some of the negative effect but not 100%.

We all already know that, though. Logically there are no benefit to be mean so it is often more of an emotion driven choice, not a logical choice.


If you give people free stuff, you should always expect people will believe it is "normal" to receive free stuff. That's human psychology. That's why companies offer free stuff then charge money later will always face backlash from customers but the reverse often receive praise.

From what I've seen the community reaction is 100% in line with human psychology. If you expect something different then your expectations are unrealistic to begin with.

tl;Dr: if you worked on something and don't want people being thankless, either don't be an *** or don't offer them for free or both. If you made such choice then decide things are no longer free then the result will be what we see here according to psychology.

Nothing to be surprised here.

There of course is this. https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/BGWiki:General_disclaimer

He is gooning to all this attention.

>Attention *** seeks attention

>It is given

Ummm...do people who contribute to wikipedia have the right to remove their work and cite copyright/intellectual property rights?

IANAL, but the BG wiki Copyrights page seems pretty clear that anyone has the right to copy and distribute the content on the wiki.

If you don't want your work being "stolen" then don't contribute to a public resource.

I don't give a damn about people drama but is this even correct from legal pov though?


https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_rights

Not a lawyer so I can be wrong (please correct me if I am wrong), the moment the content is published on bg wiki people freely share it, as long as author's moral right is respected.

According to wiki:
The moral rights include the right of attribution, the right to have a work published anonymously or pseudonymously, and the right to the integrity of the work.

So if the author wants to publish anonymously it is their right, but the content can still be shared?

Edit: somebody beat me to it.

Believing that information that is given and distributed freely on the internet will be in turn be freely given and distributed isn't entitlement, it's common sense.

Believing that information you've gathered from dozens of people and put into one place is yours, repeatedly moderating other people's information out of that place, and then one day deleting that place because hurting other people is the only way you know how to cope with your life? Now that is entitlement.

What is love?

Exactly my thought. Except I think if the author no longer wants to associate their name with the content it is their right to stay anonymously (moral right).

So I am guessing (again not lawyer, don't take it as legal advice) sharing the content is okay but if the author made a claim to remove his name on the guide then he can?

I mean, I have to be honest here: This whole thing makes me trust BG Wiki less as a resource. I don't know what content is actually part of it and what content is just on loan from the various contributors, so how can I rely on it now? Will somebody decide they've put a lot of work into walkthroughs for missions, and that those should thus be deleted when they leave?

If you're going to have a public repository, it kind of has to have the assumption that whatever goes into it stays; if it's ephemeral and subject to removal on a whim, it needs to be distinctly separate.

That's what wikis are. Open to all edits. The only time it's a problem is when you get *** willing to have edit wars.

Bad actors acting bad.

The irony…

Just take away his mod privileges (seriously?) and repost the guides. Call it a day. They aren't intellectual property, they aren't copyrighted (you literally have to pay the US gov't for a copyright, and it has to be granted. Yes, it can be rejected. Can pretty much guarantee no one that has ever written a guide has attempted it) Morals and FFXI divorced 20 years ago.

Most of the people who own BGwiki don't give a crap, they don't play and don't care one way or the other. Spicyryan can rub his *** all over the site for all they care. If they cared he would not still have admin rights.

This is why it's important to never be reliant on one wiki, all information where possible should be mirrored on both.

You should be able to go to one place. Everything is easier to find that way.

Just so happens that place may no longer be bgwiki. Just like it used to be somepage. Just like it used to be ffxiclopedia.

Really? I believe you get it automatically the moment you created something in most countries.

https://www.copyrightlaws.com/how-to-get-a-copyright/



It's just that bg-wiki is a different case because it uses CC BY-NC-SA 3.0 License. If you want to own all the right of your work then you can not publish on bg-wiki. If you publish your work somewhere else you shouldn't need to apply for it.