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Opinions on rank of best damage dealers
Server: Pandemonium
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4261
By Pandemonium.Eternaltriumph 2009-10-09 20:07:28
Kungfuhustle said: Eternaltriumph said: Kungfuhustle said: Ironguy said: ranger is bad and you should feel bad. says the guy who whined like a *** when he found out his e-girlfriend isn't a virgin. Yup, she went black too(derail!) However you found this out. I lol'd. And no, she didn't go black. I would know. xD she went Jew O.o? gdi I'm not a jew. xD
Server: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10387
By Siren.Enternius 2009-10-09 20:08:56
Enternius said: Vegetto said:
How often can a rng shoot though compared to a DD's melee attacks? It's your delay + w/e snapshot you have sporting over 500 delay? With all the haste available my tomoe sam has 64 haste in a proper merit build w/ gear and buffs. 480 delay tomoe brings me to 172.8 delay. You may get off a good amount/shot but when i'm doing 3-4 attacks per your one and have the same hit build as you, see where this is going?
Well, let's do some simple math here. Vali's Bow (490)+Kabura Arrow (90) 490+90=580, -20% because of 20% Snapshot 580*.80=464, -30% because of Rapid Shot 464*.70=325, 325 is my base delay. Then you have to account for the fact that Ranged delay is not the same as melee delay, 110 Ranged delay is the equivalent of 1 second for RNG. 325/110=2.95 seconds per shot. 172/60=2.87 per polearm hit, for you. And that's without nagging BRDs and RDMs for Haste. Forgot to add something in here. Velocity Shot is another 15% delay decrease. 325*.85=276/110=2.5 seconds per shot, so RNG would actually be faster than Polearm for at least 3x as much damage per hit.
Server: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-10-09 20:10:18
Eternaltriumph said: Kungfuhustle said: Eternaltriumph said: Kungfuhustle said: Ironguy said: ranger is bad and you should feel bad. says the guy who whined like a *** when he found out his e-girlfriend isn't a virgin. Yup, she went black too(derail!) However you found this out. I lol'd. And no, she didn't go black. I would know. xD she went Jew O.o? gdi I'm not a jew. xD oh.. YOU *** her?! Damn!
Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:12:10
Enternius said: Enternius said: Vegetto said:
How often can a rng shoot though compared to a DD's melee attacks? It's your delay + w/e snapshot you have sporting over 500 delay? With all the haste available my tomoe sam has 64 haste in a proper merit build w/ gear and buffs. 480 delay tomoe brings me to 172.8 delay. You may get off a good amount/shot but when i'm doing 3-4 attacks per your one and have the same hit build as you, see where this is going?
Well, let's do some simple math here. Vali's Bow (490)+Kabura Arrow (90) 490+90=580, -20% because of 20% Snapshot 580*.80=464, -30% because of Rapid Shot 464*.70=325, 325 is my base delay. Then you have to account for the fact that Ranged delay is not the same as melee delay, 110 Ranged delay is the equivalent of 1 second for RNG. 325/110=2.95 seconds per shot. 172/60=2.87 per polearm hit, for you. And that's without nagging BRDs and RDMs for Haste. Forgot to add something in here. Velocity Shot is another 15% delay decrease. 325*.85=276/110=2.5 seconds per shot, so RNG would actually be faster than Polearm for at least 3x as much damage per hit. This is assuming the snapshot merits work the way you said, which you yourself admitted to not testing. I've never seen rngs shooting off that quickly.
Server: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10387
By Siren.Enternius 2009-10-09 20:14:32
Vegetto said: This is assuming the snapshot merits work the way you said, which you yourself admitted to not testing. I've never seen rngs shooting off that quickly. Actually that's assuming it DOESN'T work that way. If it did, you'd add another 10% delay reduction. And that's not single per-hit delay, that's over time. RNG will take about 25% longer than that, but assuming a 20% base proc rate on Rapid Shot, and 5% in merits, that's a 25% reduction, OVER TIME, not per shot. And you can't say you can't count Rapid Shot in delay because that's like me saying you can't count Hasso. It happens so it counts.
Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:16:57
Again, you'd just have to plain show me some parses. I've partied w/ some pretty sick rngs and have never been impressed. I don't know much about ranged dmg math so I can't rly dispute anything there since i can't check it over myself, but I've never seen anything even close to what you're describing, and this is with some pretty sick geared rngs i've pt'd w/.
Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:22:52
What's your definition of well geared? Blu? blu? blu? >.>
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Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:25:53
No, I meant on "well geared" 2handed DDs that are losing to the blu, not the gear on the blu.
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Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:31:18
Now that I'd have to see, drgs getting beat by blu and thf w/ said set up on colibri? >.>
As for the drk, ares body is ***to tp in, so I can see someone who would have that choice in gear getting easily outparsed by a lot of jobs.
Server: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10387
By Siren.Enternius 2009-10-09 20:33:38
Vegetto said: Again, you'd just have to plain show me some parses. I've partied w/ some pretty sick rngs and have never been impressed. I don't know much about ranged dmg math so I can't rly dispute anything there since i can't check it over myself, but I've never seen anything even close to what you're describing, and this is with some pretty sick geared rngs i've pt'd w/. Well the max Snapshot attainable was 10% until recently, when SE added ACP body, Zha'Go's Barbut, Jalzahn's Ring, Gastraphetes, and Commodore Gants all within one year. If you haven't been with a good RNG lately, that's why you haven't seen such speed.
Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:39:10
Oh, I was talking more of the blu rather than thf, but even then vs drg, another piercing job and a 2hander at that, I can see a thf taking out the non piercing 2handers at birds though q/ the proper set up.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 36553
By Asura.Ludoggy 2009-10-09 20:41:41
Fredjan said:
drk... idk what to say
you REALLY dont know what to say?
Server: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10387
By Siren.Enternius 2009-10-09 20:43:28
Fredjan said:
drk... idk what to say
I'll say it for you then. A very well-geared DRK, in merits, is one of the best jobs you can have in a party. They're the tank, the main DD, and the main healer (Catastrophe drains 500 HP and a DRK can do it once every 15 seconds or so, combine that with Seigan+Third Eye and Dread Spikes and DRK can sustain themselves in merits) Plus DRK is like the only job that can have constant capped Haste, with Apoc.
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Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:44:04
Anyways, as far as bird pts go Relics allowed? Yes: Sam wins No: Sam wins Mamools I would have to rank differently, will think of a top for those later xD
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Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:46:07
Enternius said: Fredjan said:
drk... idk what to say
I'll say it for you then. A very well-geared DRK, in merits, is one of the best jobs you can have in a party. They're the tank, the main DD, and the main healer (Catastrophe drains 500 HP and a DRK can do it once every 15 seconds or so, combine that with Seigan+Third Eye and Dread Spikes and DRK can sustain themselves in merits) Plus DRK is like the only job that can have constant capped Haste, with Apoc. While it's still great, not denying that, I've always personally believed that cata haste was overrated just a smidge. If you have a perfect haste build prior to adding cata, you're not gaining much haste at all, just a few slots where you can swap out ur old haste for new gear, but that won't come close to any situation where you would have actually benefited from all of the haste.
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Server: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10387
By Siren.Enternius 2009-10-09 20:50:06
Vegetto said: Enternius said: Fredjan said:
drk... idk what to say
I'll say it for you then. A very well-geared DRK, in merits, is one of the best jobs you can have in a party. They're the tank, the main DD, and the main healer (Catastrophe drains 500 HP and a DRK can do it once every 15 seconds or so, combine that with Seigan+Third Eye and Dread Spikes and DRK can sustain themselves in merits) Plus DRK is like the only job that can have constant capped Haste, with Apoc. While it's still great, not denying that, I've always personally believed that cata haste was overrated just a smidge. If you have a perfect haste build prior to adding cata, you're not gaining much haste at all, just a few slots where you can swap out ur old haste for new gear, but that won't come close to any situation where you would have actually benefited from all of the haste. Catastrophe's Haste isn't gear haste. It's in the same category as Hasso meaning it stacks with your 25% gear Haste for 50% constant Haste.
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Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:50:23
As far as merits go I'd have to put soboro/yochi over kc/yochi(annihilator). The sam will be ws'ing much more often as well as being able to self SC namas namas and get dmg out the ***.
Server: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-09 20:51:31
Enternius said: Vegetto said: Enternius said: Fredjan said:
drk... idk what to say
I'll say it for you then. A very well-geared DRK, in merits, is one of the best jobs you can have in a party. They're the tank, the main DD, and the main healer (Catastrophe drains 500 HP and a DRK can do it once every 15 seconds or so, combine that with Seigan+Third Eye and Dread Spikes and DRK can sustain themselves in merits) Plus DRK is like the only job that can have constant capped Haste, with Apoc. While it's still great, not denying that, I've always personally believed that cata haste was overrated just a smidge. If you have a perfect haste build prior to adding cata, you're not gaining much haste at all, just a few slots where you can swap out ur old haste for new gear, but that won't come close to any situation where you would have actually benefited from all of the haste. Catastrophe's Haste isn't gear haste. It's in the same category as Hasso meaning it stacks with your 25% gear Haste for 50% constant Haste. It's gear haste, which is why apoc drks wear ares/HQ JSE legs in place of homam.
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Curious to see how people would rank the different damage dealing jobs according to best damage output. No restrictions on gear; looking for the very best.
I know right now everyone is all "sam sam sam" but I think a pimped out WAR trumps it. Also BLM is up there somewhere.
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