String Theory: A Puppetmaster's Guide *NEW*

Maybe its damage +10% :O (like for everything automaton does physically)

It would be quite amazing, but I don't have that much faith in SE.

Isn't it the same thing as the attachment

https://www.bg-wiki.com/bg/Magniplug

It could be, but attachment specifically says about weapon damage. Here is just DMG: +10 and it wouldnt be the first time they list something without % (look at Oshosi Mask being % increase or every "triple/double attack" damage +x also being % increase.

EDIT: Actually, Im starting to strongly believe it will be +10%.

If it's damage+10% then it's likely the best for pretty much everything, despite the lack of +X Stats

(technically it could still have a hidden +X Stats, some Animators in the past had that, didn't they?)

I agree it likely the same an Magna plug.

I hope the item text about being difficult to use is just window dressing.

I don't understand the hp+20 though. that seems rather odd augment. its not enough to be much help.

It could've been HP +200, but +20 sounds so irrelevant, I dunno

Made a quick video comparison of the new New Animator vs Animator P +1 - long story short it's not worth it considering it costs 2M gil to purchase.

Im not totally convinced by this video. Arcuballista has scaling with TP, so not really good WS to test with, unless you control it and fire at exactly same TP (for example at 3000TP using COR for regain). Also those mobs can pop at lvl 122 to 124 and between 122 and 124 there is bigger difference than you could expect.

Ideally I would test if its 10% or +10 dmg first by going outside of starter town and hit mobs there (just remember bees, birds etc. takes higher damage from ranged attacks) with ranged attack (it has no random modifiers, so will always be the same) and check damage difference between both Animators. Then maybe with 3000 Arcuballista (not sure if you can force automaton to start the fight with WS when it has TP?).

Dood. Just literally shoot a level 1 mob with and without it.

Same thing with a magnaplug. Not a ws. just a shot.

If Automatons use something like fSTR2, then shooting a lvl 0-1 mob would just give you bad results in favor of Neo Animator, I think.

Best way to test this would probably be Cliffclinger Toads or Apex Toads in Woh Gates while using Armor Shatterer. Fixed fTP, massive native Attack Bonus to cap PDIF (maybe throw in Grape Daifuku and Dia 2 for good measure) and check WS numbers after the first Shatterer because of the Defense Down. And always make sure the mob level is the same between tests.

Okay did a re-take on Apex Toads and results still seem lack-luster for new animator... unless I foobar'd this test?

I dont want it for comparison with other animator, I want it to check if its dmg +10% or weapon damage +10.

EDIT: NVM saw a video. Its enough.

New Animator is officially a garbage. We can move on.

Oof, I expected weaker WSs, but even the white damage is noticeably worse. This Neo Animator seems really bad, but not surprising since they gave WSD to a HTH job post-rework. Guess it's really only useful if you want a Ranged/Ammo piece with master stats while you're in a high-buff situation without wanting to make the maton completely useless.

It's also a potentially easier-to-obtain alternative to Divinator if you don't have the Job Points for an Animator Z or P. Well, in the sense you can just buy it after the unlock instead of hoping for a drop.

I mean, it's still the best choice when you care about master DPS and not puppet though. WSD+5% on PUP is kinda dumb, and Acc+10 isn't some huge important thing... but those stats are something.

If you're meleeing alongside a tank automaton where you don't care about puppet DPS (not a "bruiser" tanky DD puppet loadout), or a mage frame and you're punching stuff... use this? Kinda disappointed in inventory -1, TBH, but minor improvement is still BiS. I've paid 2M for less.

Key part is that inventory-1.

The new Neo Animator isn't that terrible, but totally not worth the 2m gil. For newer pups without enough JPs or access to Divinator it may be an option.

I got the unlock for this on the first try by killing the Acuex NM on PUP with 1hr (totally not needed). Don't remember the name.

Other people on different jobs didn't get the unlock of course.

I also tried 2 other NMs in there and one doomed me 5 times in a row. Luckily I brought Holy Water. Got access to the new Ammo and SMN item.

Hardest part is losing access to your trusts after you've used them. Annoying part is how after doing this SE decided to totally re-arrange your trust list.

The NMs are actually easier than Sheol A NMs IMO.

Here's a fast checkparam on the new Neo Animator. Not sure if it was in the video above or not.

Neo Animator/Animator P+1
Acc: 1251/1262
Attack: 1256/1270
Ranged ACC: 1298/1309
Ranged Attack; 1320/1333
Evasion: 888/897
Defense: 1234/1278
DPS: 9570 (341.79)/10826(349.23)

PS I didn't use any maneuevers or food. No gear changes.

I don't think you understand what the testing is really trying to do. It's not a comparison parse which doesn't really say ***as there are tons of varialbles going on. It's trying to test how it works which then can be extrapolated with the proper math and such to get an idea how they would compare in different situations. Also changing the fstr might actually work with this (actually haven't thought of testing it but didn't work with manaplug) but that would be another thing this test would find out. Also remember autos have some weird stat factor into their base damage too

Shooting the level 1 as suggested would indeed be the best way to test how it works.

People really need to stop the wrongheaded comments that Neo Animator isn't worth a measly 2mil gil. That's really only true if the only thing you do on PUP is puppet-only DPS. It's clearly the best master-focused piece in the slot. It's just situational, like tons of pieces in the game.

Neo Animator: use when you're DDing with the master
Animator P +1: use if you're focused on puppet melee DPS (or a tank where you aren't engaging with master)
Animator P II +1: use if you're using a nuking puppet

Its not that easy.

WSD is very poor stat for h2h WSs after the update. Its basicaly okish for Dragon Kick, Tornado Kick and Howling Fist. For Vsmite, Pummel, Shijin, Asuran or Raging, that 5%WSD will barely increase total WS damage by 1% or less. On 20k WS, 1% or less is 200damage or less. In the Apex video we clearly can see that damage difference for Automaton even on 10k WS is around 750, then there is also regular hits damage difference. So if you DD with puppet, would Neo Animator even be a gain? If you only spam Howling Fist, then maybe (it would still be extremely marginal improvement, that might not be worth inventory slot for many). If you use Pummel, VS, Asuran etc. your overall master+automaton damage might actually drop.

Of course I understand what the testing was trying to do; I simply elected to disregard it. My suggestion wasn't even for a parse to begin with and you just missed the point of the post: no matter the results you get on a level 1 mob with the Neo Animator, if it doesn't perform well compared to Animator P +1 on standard ilevel mobs within a controlled environment (read: pDIF-capped fixed fTP WSs), then it's relatively safe to assume it'll be inferior for pet burning in general. Simple as that.

And it'll save time coming up with a theoretical model telling you the same thing in the end. Maton primary attributes can't be as easily changed as player stats outside of Maneuvers, so there's not much you can realistically do even if there are fringe cases where Neo Animator is better. There are optimal Maneuvers and attachments for most situations you can't just ignore for a little bit of extra damage. Given the showcased results you aren't suddenly going to get massively superior numbers by making a few tweaks.

The only thing that could redeem it at this point would be if the HP augment were a % increase.

Sure you got me. Not a parse just comparing damages between them on ilvl mobs...

Either way if we gunna assume we capped and not changing anything and any old ilvl will be reflective of situations in general then we also throw the need to do any real modeling and just directly compare level 0 mobs and get the same level of assuredness of their comparative damages . Which ends up being a bit less work to control and test unless you want to spend more time being MORE sure of their comparative damages. Especially considering a fair amount of ground work on base damages, how stats and mangiplugs effect them on both normal shots and ws on level 0 mobs. And then for less time you'd get your answer WHILE also providing data to further knowledge on how it works so IF someone wants to do extra modeling and build upon things they can. Knowledge and testing can be cumulative... and it would also be nice to know if hey maybe like you suggested it effected fstr2 and by extension stat mods... or if it actually worked correctly like how magniplug or incorrectly like stat mods on ws... and if like the former can file a bug report that SE will ignore for years.

Not sure what the rest is about since no where have I made any kind of statement on the usefulness of it alone.

Parsing data in a simple comparison and a parse generally have different meanings in the context of FFXI. Maybe that was my fault for misunderstanding, but perhaps you could have been clearer too.


Of course you could extrapolate useful data from a level 0-1 mob test for the Neo Animator's DMG+10--nobody's arguing otherwise. And there's nothing stopping us from doing that even at this point if you want to go through the trouble. However, if someone were to make a mistake in their calculations or was missing something important, it could lead to bad results from which people would draw wrong conclusions. On the other hand, the Apex Toad test revealed some good data as well and answered the underlying question at the same time. It just was a matter of efficiency to get to that answer quickly after the update.


Because you randomly brought up the testing methods again after we already had pretty conclusive results? Anyway, I'm done with this. It feels too much like you're trying to argue with me just for the sake of it and I'd rather not fill up the PUP thread unnecessarily.

The only problem I see this Animator will probably have 3rd augment and that can be amazing or poo. I would probably farm it blindly if it was like 500 segments per NM, but not 3000 XD

MAB MACC or Snapshot would have been better on Neo Animator no ?

That's a good point, actually. SE showed off the items on stream capped at Rank 20, which is unusual for the final versions of RP items (which are usually R15 or R25). We've only seen R20 for +1 Dyna items so far, if I'm not mistaken.

It's still unlikely they'd raise the RP cap on already existing items, but hope dies last. If we could get something like Automaton Special Attack Damage +5%-20% with the last 5 ranks it would be the the best physical DD Animator by far.

Quick question, there is a part on the bg wiki guide that says that you only need -36& Pet Damage Taken to attain capped -DT on your automaton, when you have Valoredge frame, Armor Plate IV, Optic Fiber 1 + 2 and Light Maneuver.

With that in mind, the suggested tank turtle set on the guide is this:


That set has:
Anwing Salade: -10%DT
Sheperd's Chain: -2%DT
Rimeice Earring: -1%DT
Enmerkar Earring: -3%DT
Rao Body +1 Path C: -4%DT
Rao Hands +1 Path C: -4%DT
Rao Legs +1 Path C: -4% DT
Rao Feet +1 Path C: -4% DT
Isa belt: -3% %DT
Thurandaut Ring HQ/NQ: -4%DT / -3%DT
Total: -39 % DT with HQ Ring / -38%DT with NQ Ring.

Is it me that set has more Pet DT than needed? If thats the case, i think we could use the neck/ear slot for something else.

That's not quite accurate. That part of the guide seems to be conflating pdt with DT. A valoredge with AP4, OF1/2 and 1 light maneuver would have ~9% DT+ ~12.5% mdt, ~12.5% bdt, ~42.5% pdt. For most situations that means 21.5% mdt/bdt and 42.5% pdt. So yeah 36% dt would cap you pdt but would still need another 30 to cap mdt/bdt.

So yeah that's part of why that set overcaps since it would end up with capped pdt, 70.5% mdt and 60.5% bdt.

Thanks a lot, i think i got it now.