Dev Tracker - Discussion

Nope, strong disagree.

Game good.
SE neutral because they provide the game but the methods they choose to do so are questionable and thus need to be talked about because we're a community who has a long standing relationship of making this game better than it should have been.

RMT pay subs so they are customers. If customers can be considered bad then RMT aren't the only bad customer and since they pay a sub they have at least some redeeming value to the idea of good customers.

Look at the new patch note preview. It's bare bones. We need to talk about it. That's the POINT of a dev tracker discussion.

I'm personally waiting for the day to warm up for 30 minutes so I can clean up my back woods. I'm totally wasting my life how I want waiting to enjoy wasting more of my life also how I want.

They claim the special task force is still active, banning accounts and removing gil, they still post stats about it:

http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/rule/specialtask.html

I check this every so often, the trend in # of accounts and amount of gil removed is kindof interesting, especially going back into the earlier eras of the game and around 2020.

Not that I disagree with you on the rest, I think it's a conscious decision to keep the CP/EP/level bots going for instance, but it's worth noting they claim to still be active and doing stuff. I'm just not sure what or who they are banning.

EDIT: Oops, I forgot scrolling was a thing

Relic is around 18000 currency, presuming even distribution. You get 1050 per month and an additional 525 every third month, lets break that down to 1225 per month. 18000/1225 = 14.69 months. Aegis is even longer because of the heavier focus on Bronze.

You need 30000 Alexandrite. You get 1750 per month and an additional 875 every third month, avg to 2041.67 per month. 30000/2041.67 = 14.69 months.

You need 13999 HPBayld. You get 750 per month and an additional 375 every third month, avg to 875 per month. 13999/875 = 15.99 months

You need 1500 HMP's. You get 100 per month and 50 every third month, 116.67 monthly. 1500/116.67 = 12.85 Months. You then need 60 CinDross. You get 3 per month and an additional 2 every third month, 3.67 monthly. 60/3.67 = 16.36 Months

But none of those timelines matter because REM stones take longer than all of that. You need 10300. You get 500 per month and an additional 250 every third month, 583.33 monthly. 10300/583.33 = 17.65 months. Thats presuming Ambu only, but those stones are by far the easiest to stumble upon in the open world.

As I said, all REM's take over a year to complete if just farming through Ambuscade (because buying and selling encourages P2W mechanics), its simple math and math doesnt lie.

I'm even moreso annoyed that were gonna get hosed with TWO maintenances because they screwed up their own update timeline. They have to take down the servers to reset the login campaign stuff.

Ok, we really need to clarify this overusage of "p2w". Just because a game has a currency system and that currency system allows purchasing of items or trading said currency to a player for a service does not constitute "pay to win". This is a very specific term that speaks only to developer-implemented methods to pay real world cash to advance in a game, and such advancement is gated behind that transaction.

Even people paying cash for gil from a 3rd party isn't "p2w". That's RMT, quite a different issue and concept.

Stop just lumping any time someone pays gil for something into p2w. Its inaccurate, diminishes your arguments, and flat out foolish.

I totally agree with you that this still exists and someone updates it. I also point out we can make up numbers in a report to say we did work, when in fact we did not do said work.


yeah 2 maintenances without anything included as a real update is pretty bad.

Item-related
April Items ・ Add new items -

I was hoping we'd get the next step in Prime Weapons in the next patch or 2 but now I think my expectations are by the end of summer.

I'm 110% taking the piss out of Seun's comments that buying anything is supporting RMT, which promotes P2W. Thats why I keep referencing it in my posts, unfortunately sarcasm doesnt translate well into written word.

You act like this is New... They have been doing super early April patches since 2016. They did not screw up anything it is part of their routine

April 5th 2016

April 4th 2017

April 4th 2018

April 3rd 2019

April 3rd 2020

April 2nd 2021

April 4th 2022

They *** up the login timeline, they've been lining it up so there aren't two stoppages.

Again, this is why you supplement Ambu with the campaigns.

Personally, I can farm the KI, 70 merits and clear 8 HTMB inside of an hour. Over the course of a campaign(roughly 3 weeks) I can earn enough currency for AG if I full clear KI and merits twice a day for the duration.

In cases where you happen to be farming for relic or empy, you end up with tons of beitetsu you can sell/trade for the plates/rifts if you don't have a surplus of voidstones.




I have no doubt that tens if not hundreds of millions of gil that I've made over the years came from someone who purchased it with real money. I understand that it's impossible to parse every gil that passes into/out of your purse and I'm not suggesting that anyone try.


What I am suggesting is that you not tout yourself as 'legit' because you hard farmed gil and then handed it over to RMT to carry you. I don't technically call this P2W by the way because you're trading your time rather than your money, but you're essentially working for them. Do you at least have a good benefits package? Pull your head out.

I cant believe you support RMT and P2W mechanics. What a horrible thing to confess to. Absolutely abhorrent. You have no shame.

It's impossible to escape people who are too lazy to actually play the game themselves anymore. Sad isn't it?

Twenty years on and you're all still mad at the people who buy gil rather than the company that decided to divide this game into Fun and Not-Fun and proceeded make the Not-Fun part so terrible that people would pay money not to play it

I can't believe the discussion made it this far without anyone speculating on whether Primes will be merc-friendly, RMT-friendly, or both. Or how SE could set it up so that neither really helps to finish a weapon.

It's nearly impossible to make something unmercable or unbuyable. Magian trials have the only answer. It is impossible to buy "use ws" trials in any fashion. (you could let someone log you in...)

So if they go build stage 3 and use ws 1 million times to open stage 4,that's it. Maybe solo only bcnms but that would be an absolute nightmare.
(mythic vs balrahn)

Step 1 buy this NFT. Problem solved. Now everyone loses.

Kinda depends. For example Relic and I think mythic upgrades, that require WS use allows other party members to do those WS and they count for you, so it would be possible to merc those.

This is why you stay blocked. No. You cannot. You just have to jump in without reading and contradict.

Kill with, yes. Party up for kill shots.
Use, no. You and only you can use the weaponskill for that trial.

Yeah you can do that. They added the team up feature after the first few lvl cap updates. 1500 WS kills while fighting over camps was a nightmare. The team up feature made it more tolerable. (it was still stupid grindy, worse than ML 45-50 IMO)

Kill with =/= use

1045 YOU must use cata
1046 any party member can kill with cata

Omg, please nooooo. How can I live now knowing that..

I believe these numbers because I know that T. alone is 300 of those accounts! (E. is another 200 and the other e. is 250 more)

Fake *** don't do a damn thing STF lol

Literal boogeymen. Keeping you in line with fear but no action.

Pay to Win could be any system where the developer actively punish's those who chose not to pay. This usually takes the form of abusive RNG based systems where the math works out to where the non-payers could never make any real progress.

Example would be that upgrading or obtaining some set of gear is a once per day limit with a 1% chance. A player would then have a 50% chance to obtain in 100 days, and if the player requires five piece of that gear then it would be a 50% chance in 500 days or 16 months. The developers replace the gear every six to eight months and as such the free player could never obtain the gear before it's replaced. A player could "pay" for a loot boost or multiple rolls that could get them that gear in a few months.

A FFXI example would be the HTBC's, imagine if the drop rates were cut to 1/10th current, but the players could pay for a "loot boost" that would raise them to current rates. Malicious segmentation at it's finest. Or imagine if Ody Amplifiers cost cash shop only magical diamonds.

There was some talk here about time needed to make a rema and it calculated in years. I know once I got the rhythm and the cash flow (no rmt, just myself), I did like 9 rema in three years and had 3 from the seven years before:

R15 Epeolatry, Twashtar, Masa, Death Penalty, Gandring, Koga, R13 Lionheart, Fomalhaut,

~119III
Excalibur, Idris, Srivatsa, Trishula, Nirvana, Yoichi

...and I feel real good about my lineup atm (if I still played). Finished with Kogarasumaru which I couldn't be more pleased with but haven't really used.

Frankly I'm surprised the discussion has been about time > gil rather than time > gating systems which is what its usually about.

I could come back and make easily 40 mil a month but you know, been there did that thing at this point. Could come back and make 3 mil a month and be fine, but you know, not gonna pay $22 a month for nostalgia.

But! See you in the free month campaign, I'll be attempting solo omen bosses with koga I think and hope to get in a wave 3 dynamis boss run and wreck shop!

The key part of this (all of which I completely agree with) is by the developer.

Or you could say that P2W is:

1) Yes: real money dollars outside of just 1st subscription paid to developer; multi-box and wardrobes count as P2W.

2) No: Pay is in-game gil interactions.

3) RMT is third category and of course P2W.

I consider multiboxing to be P2W, but it is driven by player intent and not developer incentive.

Even more, multiboxing is technically forbidden right?

Yes and no. Not technically breaking ToS to run multiple accounts. I can't speak for everyone, but everyone I know who runs more than 2 accounts at a time is tool assisted which is forbidden. I'm not aware of any official word from SE, but I do know that multiboxing and broadcasting software is banned in other games.