Dev Tracker - Discussion

I'm with you, I'm kind of disappointed too. I hate last minute schedule adjustments. However, I'm happy they caught whatever bug was present in Sortie before releasing it to the players. I remember how terribly terrible the Gaol lag was when it was first released. Fun fighting Gogmagog and then 5 seconds later your player had 0 HP without any knowledge as to what happened >. I also recall that Gaol also had some other bugs that caused them delay it for a couple of months, or whatever. At this point, it should be expected that any new event will have some minor flukes that the players find after release, but I don't want to play Sortie if it has some major bug, especially if it largely impacts my run for the day. Losing a 20HR KI to something STUPID will infuriate me to no end. Would rather them just fix it.

With that being said, as compensation, they should modify the NPC to be able to carry multiple key items, so that we can catch up on lost time. 3 sounds about fair :D

I don't mind waiting a little while longer. That gear is gettin' got in short order as soon as it rolls out. I'm just eager to see the stats on +2/earrings, which I'm sure will present in the .dats on the 10th.

This may be the case for players content with v0 clears, but for those wanting augments, you absolutely get left behind if you don't do it regularly and accrue segments.

Let's assume you have someone that can take you in at v20 for all the clears, are geared for it (extremely unlikely), and you win each one the first time (near 0 chance). It still takes you ~51k segments to get the clears w/o using amps. The folks I know who got the v20 clears early on said they spent around 400-500k segments doing it, I think if I counted the number of failed runs (aura, PUG nonsense, bad luck, etc), I'd be around 200k at least (forgetting RP runs) and that is with well geared folks that know the fights (and a few PUG attempts here and there). This number grows significantly if you don't have direct v20 access from someone that already did it or did the v15 climb and are now doing v20.

Then to get RP to max a piece out, you are looking at again, around 51k per piece (assuming a kill every time, which is not realistic). So for a full set, ~250k unless you charge and even then, it is a fair bit. That all assumes a kill each time, which isn't going to happen, so it's likely a lot higher. So the RP is easy, but the prerequisite for getting RP is a daily grind that acts as a barrier to entry. It's also not possible to Ooze every NM.

Even if you assume every C farm is a 10k run, that's a lot of days needed to get sets maxed at 25. Sure, you aren't missing out if you miss a single day or even a few days, but the losses start to accrue if you don't participate regularly and you get left out when people who participate daily go and you are out of segments.

You absolutely do not need to do seg farming every single day. I'm over 200K segments and another person in our group is over 400K stored, we do triple NM runs twice a week and usually do double farming right afterwards, and that's pretty much it.

The only folks who will need to do seg farming at an insane rate are those depending on single KI + "deal 5%" runs to farm RP.

So the only people who need to do seg farming are most of the people farming RP

Let's not pretend like triple v20 runs or even triple V15 runs are the norm

I didn't say anything about daily, I said regularly, but if you aren't segment farming several times a week then you get left behind and stuck without segments. The math really isn't that complicated, the system is designed in such a way that you need to be participating regularly (staying subscribed, in theory anyway) to progress and going on a regular basis. If you can't go most days of the week, then you get left out of Gaol fights and the ability to farm RP.

As it is now, assuming a decent segfarm group every time with consistent ~10k segs and farming RP with the kill rate you receive @ 2k, it still takes 25 segfarms to have enough segments to fully RP a set. Practically, you aren't going to kill it every time and you aren't going to get 10k every time without a decent static.

The point was less that you have to go every day and more than the original post about it being designed around keeping people subscribed with daily content is correct. They dangle the carrot of augments in front of you but give you limited resources to reach it, resources which you lose without going every time it is available. I agree you don't have to go every single day, but not going at least 3-4 times a week means you get left behind.

Nobody needs v20 augmented gear for anything. You can easily complete any content with v0 non augmented gear, even this new thing they will add. The majority dont care past getting the gear, which is not hard at all. You can do this slowly over time, there is no FOMO. Its not going to be hard to complete later on, people are already selling RP of those dont want to team up.

If you have someone to take you in, then there is no reason to do the climb nor clear NM that you don't need so you can skip most of the low tier NM and save segs. Many Nyame r25 5/5 peeps from my LS doesn't even have bumba access.

You can also get RP before you get the clear, so whatever segs you wasted for the clear isn't gone for nothing.

Assuming you have someone who take you in, cleared NM on first try and killed every v20 for RP. It would be:

125750 RP required for 5 r25 pieces, 2112 RP per run, 4500 segs per run = 59.5 run = 267,933 segs total.

@10k segs per day that's 26.79 days of farming. Playing an MMO for 26 days straight isn't that long, come on.... sometimes I play the same single player game for 2-3 months straight np...

The actual time spent actually isn't that long if going for an efficient path. It's getting people for the efficient path being the hardest.

Also if you can do triple NM run and kill all 3, the efficiency increases greatly. But meh.


Not sure what's a big deal about 25 seg farms. If I do 1 seg farm a day, and paid my sub for 30 days, my sub doesn't even expire after 25 runs lol.

Weeklies and Monthlies more than daylies, but yes Dynamis (use it or lose it tags) and Odyssey (use it or lose it moglophone) were purposely designed this way.

Will the content always exist? Sure. Will there always be competent players left that need it since they grinded it when it was new? Nope. The FOMO for end game players is do it ASAP while others need it, or you are ***. You missed out and then how do you do it if you took a break? Gather an army of mid-tier players and try to get them up to doing the content? Big nope.

My SAM is BiS (bar being only R1 Doji and Masa, which came out way later than VD Ambus) pre R20 Odyssey gear. Yesterday I got told I was too gimp to do VD Ambu and the person said he didn't believe my SAM had ever done Ambu... what the ***? Most of the gear I have now wasn't even in game when I was first doing VD Ambus on it.

Do what people have done since day one, find a LS or find a static. This is ridiculous lol, these must be XIV players with this FOMO crap in such an old game. Nobody is missing anything, just take it easy and do it when you want because there isn't any content you can't do if you don't have the odyssey gear. Dynamis is dumb too, buy or get a clear and youre done unless you want to save gil.

These types of systems have always been here, so saying they are using predatory tactics all of a sudden is silly. I'm almost certain later on they will let people hold additional phones too, everything in this game gets easier as time passes, that's always been true. At first when we didn't know much about Odyssey it may have been true, but now that's its understood, i don't see a reason to care that much.

I generally assume players will want their own access and to clear all of the NMs, but you are right, that may not be a reasonable assumption. The foundation behind being able to skip straight to 20 is someone else putting in the substantial effort to get there, though, which is still a prerequisite for someone.

Assuming 2112rp each time isn't really reasonable, either, though. That assumes you kill it every time, which with some mobs in a well geared group is practical, others not so much. The fights are random by nature and I can do the same fight 10 times in a row successfully then have multiple failures due to various circumstances.

That 25 days is a single set, there are six t3 sets and one T4, along with a few good t1/t2 pieces that need augmented. Granted, some of the pieces aren't super amazing or required, some sets you can pick and choose a few pieces to max out while others you will want to push higher across the entire set. Assuming you are doing segfarms and NMs every day, you still looking at several months if you have jobs that use multiple sets, that assumes going every day and killing it every time, which isn't realistic for some mobs.

The point isn't that you absolutely have to go daily, but that not going regularly has a cost and that is by design. If you are able to go every single day and have a super effective group, then yea, you can max the most relevant pieces (Nyame, Sakpata, hit or mess on the other pieces being needed) in a few months. If you are going once or twice a week, then you are not going to be able to get there in a short period of time and you get left behind.

Few things,
BiS is not really a thing in this game so not really sure what you even mean...

Also being able to clear content is not the same as being able to join some idiot's party.

I actually prefer this way, so no lifers playing 10 hours a day isn't far ahead of casual folks with work and family only get to play 1-2 hr a day. Everyone's progress is equal, seems fair to me.

If you get unlimited tags all the hardcore player who plays 10 hr a day will finish 25 segs run in 3 days and and 25 NM kills in another 3 day. Leaving everyone else further behind. How is that better?

It's better cause that's what I want and nothing else matters

I'm not arguing that it's better, just that the original post, which said content was designed to drag out subscriptions, was correct because new content has a cost with not going and is, by design, making players feel the need to login regularly and participate, keeping subs going. You may not have to go on a daily basis, but not going several times a week means you get left behind.

I don't think giving people unlimited tags is the right approach either, but that is beside the point here.

I don't see anything unfair here and I'm talking from perspective of casual player.

If they would play that much, then why wouldn't it be fair to reward them. They would need to sacrifice other things in rl to achieve that. They won't have time to go to cinema, watch Netflix or ride a bike. Should Netflix also be limited to one movie a week so casual like me could watch it and other people with more time and willing to watch more should wait? I can understand Square Enix not wanting this, because that would let some people drop subs when they are done with the content, but what you said, coming from another player sounds like you are just insecure and jealous of people having time to play and God forbid them leaving you behind with progress. Very selfish imo.

Asura sounds like a terrible place.

Rest assured, it sounds like nothing. It is.

Ok. My gear is all as per the SAM community guide. I have done VD Ambus on SAM prior to most the gear there (Relic+3 and things). Basically RNG made me whiff 3 out of 4 WS, he said my DPS was low and that's why the other goblins gathered and wiped us, and proceeded to kick me. Most bizarre FFXI experience I have had in years.

Much harder to do when you're an EU player and have children, etc. Odyssey could have been implemented in a more friendly way if they wanted to, other than because their servers are ***and/or apparently it is impossible for them to rework how instances are handled/PS2 limitations, etc. At least for Dynamis you only had to do that ***once each (which is a bad thing, but better than Ody grind).

btw I have >100k segs just casually doing Seg C farm, but I have no idea how to get Bumba points from there without a team. I lost track of trying to understand it when the amplifier was added.

Can team up with people who has V20 Bumba access and try to clear V20 or at least V19 with them. Use amplifier if you damage it to at least 94%. Second option is to clear every NM at V20 and Bumba V15 (I think?) and get V20 Bumba access yourself.


Again, it's your life choices (I have kids too). Not everything on this world is meant to be accessed evenly for everyone. Other person might have easier time to find static, but wont have time to do something else. Seriously I have no idea where is this coming from? Are you guys really just jelous of other people life situation and regret decisions in your life or something? It's really weird.

Hmm, yeah I could try to do every single NM multiple times to have V20 access. How many NMs would that be now?

This is a HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE twist on what I said. I would obviously much rather have my children than Nyame R25. That does not mean to say I cannot wish that they added the content in a more real life friendly manner, as with all other content for years prior.

I regret that SE reversed years of making the game more friendly to people who have responsibilities. I don't know how your mind twisted that in such a pathetic way. Other than that you are a Polack.

I'm not sure why is progression in a multiplayer video game that needs a living community to work can be associated with the idea that entire playerbase having similar progression = casual players being selfish.

In an MMO, It's more ideal if the entire player base has similar progression so people can pt with each other. If the player progression gap is WAY huge then it's unhealthy for the community.

This is the reason why years after content release SE always make older content progression faster for casual/returning players. So these people isn't TOO behind the hardcore and they can pt together after they catch up.

If tag isn't limited, hardcore players will play for a month, cap everything and quit. Leaving everyone else behind less people to pt with. Or another hardcore player wants to do Odyssey but unable to find anyone because everyone else is too far behind. How is that healthy in a MMO?

Hardcore players already get rewarded in the current system. People who farm segs 7 days a week is still 5 seg runs per week ahead of casual players who farm segs 1 day(2 tags) per week. It's just that the difference isn't 30 seg runs difference per week. The hardcore/casual difference is smaller than you like it to be, but it's still there.

Your Netflix comparison is a poor argument. Netflix isn't MMO and socializing isn't part of it, you don't need to pt with anyone to watch movies. If some no lifers sub Netflix and finishes every single movie in 3 months and unsub, it doesn't affect everyone else who only watches once per month.

Tag should be limited but not so severe. Even if tags regenerated every 18h and could stack to 3 (not even 4th holding) it would be friendlier for me and people I play with that also couldn't do the daily grind.

Except this is all a fairy tale. Hardcore players will make static with other hardcore players anyway and wont party with casuals anyway. If hardcore players make party with casuals is not related to game at all, it's based on friendship or just will to help people.

I would risk completely opposite theory. If you would let hardcore players spam Odyssey, they would probably be capped in a month, but wouldn't quit at all, because hardcore players rarely quit or make breaks. They would start getting bored tho and would start helping casuals more, because they wouldn't be pressured to optimize runs anymore and they would just play for fun.

Why do people shout for V19? What is the difference to doing V20?

The add