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Jack of All Trades: A Guide to Red Mage
Asura.Saevel
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9986
By Asura.Saevel 2019-03-01 23:48:23
Why would a +500% enspell do 1000 per strike....
119 is my current base, that gives us.
+200% Composure
+500% Croc
800% total multiplier
110 * 8.0 = 952
That's pretty much maxed out damage. It's still higher then our melee hits, enspells more then double melee damage now.
Asura.Byrne
By Asura.Byrne 2019-03-02 01:53:59
Supposedly enspells are affected by Orpheus Sash (though I have not confirmed this myself), that would put it north of 1k for sure if it is multiplied across the composure and croc terms.
That said, it requires shifting around some gear, but since most of your multi-attack doesn't come from gear I could see it being worth doing.
Alternatively you could use the Ambuscade hands to push up the base damage, but if you use +1 Carmine hands you lose 1 haste, so you'd need cheer to make up for the gear haste loss assuming you aren't doing so somewhere else in gear.
Summarily it should be doable, I am not sure that it would be a big difference, but should be possible at least.
Bismarck.Ringoko
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
By Bismarck.Ringoko 2019-03-02 03:09:15
No +enspell (Dark Day Enblizzard)
Ayanmo Gloves (Dark Day Enblizzard)
Ayanmo Gloves + Orpheus (Dark Day Enblizzard)
Edit: If I recall correctly, random day bonus can proc on them too?
Edit2: Day Bonus Procs
Ayanmo gloves + Orpheus (Fire Day Enfire)
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Asura.Byrne
By Asura.Byrne 2019-03-02 04:03:01
Thanks for verifying that for us
Phoenix.Iocus
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1710
By Phoenix.Iocus 2019-03-02 07:34:42
Supposedly enspells are affected by Orpheus Sash (though I have not confirmed this myself), that would put it north of 1k for sure if it is multiplied across the composure and croc terms.
That said, it requires shifting around some gear, but since most of your multi-attack doesn't come from gear I could see it being worth doing.
Alternatively you could use the Ambuscade hands to push up the base damage, but if you use +1 Carmine hands you lose 1 haste, so you'd need cheer to make up for the gear haste loss assuming you aren't doing so somewhere else in gear.
Summarily it should be doable, I am not sure that it would be a big difference, but should be possible at least.
Orpheus Sash does increase Enspell damage, the same as any affinity piece will, it's just unique in that it enhances every element so you can match weather or day bonuses without thinking. It's the same result as Atma of the Lion for Lightning damage or Levante dagger for Wind.
I'm not sure how it would work with a Levante dagger in the offhand for enaero, since i tossed mine a while back and I don't have a Crocea to test.
By geigei 2019-03-02 08:43:50
In the last picture those 400dmg are resists or offhand hits?
By Aerix 2019-03-02 09:09:16
Pretty sure those are offhand hits, as resists would be 50%/25%/12.5% of the standard damage, i.e. 1067/2 = 533~ or 1173/4 = 293~
Bahamut.Agerine
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 433
By Bahamut.Agerine 2019-03-02 09:55:22
Supposedly enspells are affected by Orpheus Sash (though I have not confirmed this myself), that would put it north of 1k for sure if it is multiplied across the composure and croc terms.
That said, it requires shifting around some gear, but since most of your multi-attack doesn't come from gear I could see it being worth doing.
Alternatively you could use the Ambuscade hands to push up the base damage, but if you use +1 Carmine hands you lose 1 haste, so you'd need cheer to make up for the gear haste loss assuming you aren't doing so somewhere else in gear.
Summarily it should be doable, I am not sure that it would be a big difference, but should be possible at least.
Orpheus Sash does increase Enspell damage, the same as any affinity piece will, it's just unique in that it enhances every element so you can match weather or day bonuses without thinking. It's the same result as Atma of the Lion for Lightning damage or Levante dagger for Wind.
I'm not sure how it would work with a Levante dagger in the offhand for enaero, since i tossed mine a while back and I don't have a Crocea to test.
Are we keen on any other sorta specific elemental affinity pieces we could take advantage of here? I used the fire affinity atma while doin Bismarck last week and got a hell of a boost, was thinkin about that dagger also, would be good in this months Ambu I believe(used Enaero all month personally) Not sure if any weird pieces are tucked away. I don’t think Magian Trials offers affinity paths do they?
edit: lame RDM ain’t on the Ifrit Sword.
By Aerix 2019-03-02 16:44:46
Levante Dagger is nice, but it would only benefit Enaero exclusively and not all mobs are weak/neutral to Wind. Malevolence/Kaja Knife boost Sanguine Blade, which probably shouldn't be neglected just to maximize Enspells.
Asura.Byrne
By Asura.Byrne 2019-03-02 17:33:29
I gotta admit though, its' nice to have a full enspell-tilted set to swap to if you get amnesia'd or the mob uses Invincible.
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By Aerix 2019-03-02 19:06:49
Once I've upgraded my Crocea to R25 I'll try to do a 20-30 min parse on Apex mobs for each weapon setup to compare R15 Almace CDC spam to Crocea Sanguine spam just to have an idea which will have more general DPS. Probably going to compare SB spam with Raetic+1 offhand too and post them here.
By geigei 2019-03-06 07:40:15
Made this cheap/easy to get healing set:
ItemSet 365446
Focus on capped potency I, capped enmity and high healing skill (509).
Rdm/blm taru heals for 958 with IV, works great for not having adoulin ring locked, AF legs, kaykaus +1 stuff (havent seen a body lately on my server).
Relies heavily on weapon slot so is not melee friendly, storm up or day proc is only 14 enmity loss and mnd (-5hp from 20mnd) from back/waist.
Valefor.Sapphire
Server: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1828
By Valefor.Sapphire 2019-03-06 08:07:21
Made this cheap/easy to get healing set:
ItemSet 365446
Focus on capped potency I, capped enmity and high healing skill (509).
Rdm/blm taru heals for 958 with IV, works great for not having adoulin ring locked, AF legs, kaykaus +1 stuff (havent seen a body lately on my server).
Relies heavily on weapon slot so is not melee friendly, storm up or day proc is only 14 enmity loss and mnd (-5hp from 20mnd) from back/waist. Menelaus ring is 2-7m and rarely stocked depending on server, also esper+1 aint cheap or sold often.
Lebeche ring as an option is easy to get.
Everything else i agree is easy/budget for anyone to get.
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Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 86
By Asura.Shaedhen 2019-03-06 09:04:15
Does the Magic damage from Belisama rope somehow boosts cure ? Because Pythia Sash is much much cheaper for the same amount of enmity - and +5MND
By geigei 2019-03-06 09:11:01
Does the Magic damage from Belisama rope somehow boosts cure ? Nope, good find.
By tyalangan 2019-03-06 09:39:18
Generally, are you guys finding the need for the 20 macc from bow? Having to decide between it and sword this month and I’m unsure of a situation where I’d desire 20 acc over potency.
Edit: Maybe I should just wait until the update to see additional changes.
By Cronnus 2019-03-06 10:04:28
ItemSet 365452
I was seeing up to 1440 a hit on en-blizzard in Dynamis Jeuno. I'm guessing they just are weaker to ice in wave 1 and 2?
Also, I've seen others TP sets and I chose this one for the sake of STP and magic acc and capped dual wield. Any constructive criticism?
By geigei 2019-03-06 10:06:12
Is there haste augm on cape?
Bahamut.Agerine
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 433
By Bahamut.Agerine 2019-03-06 10:19:35
@Cronnus I was seeing similar higher end damage in jeuno on Monday night also. Was messing around with different enspells ans Enblizzard got me up to 1117 unreaisted hits on wave2 with R14 Crocea. I was pretty surprised to see it that high at a lower ranking.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3185
By Asura.Geriond 2019-03-06 10:41:58
ItemSet 365452
I was seeing up to 1440 a hit on en-blizzard in Dynamis Jeuno. I'm guessing they just are weaker to ice in wave 1 and 2?
Also, I've seen others TP sets and I chose this one for the sake of STP and magic acc and capped dual wield. Any constructive criticism? With as much multi-attack RDM gets, using Anu Torque or Ainia Collar would probably be better assuming you're not starved for accuracy (and Combatant's Torque if you are).
Swapping legs to Carmine +1 (Path D) would also mostly solve your haste issues.
By Cronnus 2019-03-06 10:42:43
Is there haste augm on cape?
Ah, nope. STP on the cape. I'm only at 20%. I missed that
By Aerix 2019-03-06 15:28:49
Ternion+1 dagger doesn't really help with the things Crocea Path C does best. Try to get a Kaja Knife or Malevolence for your offhand instead.
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3753
By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2019-03-06 15:47:21
Ternion+1 dagger doesn't really help with the things Crocea Path C does best. Try to get a Kaja Knife or Malevolence for your offhand instead.
question: is it better to aim for an improvement to each individual enspell hit (through an offhand like kaja knife if accuracy needed or malevolence if accuracy not) or improve the number of of hits over time (through an offhand like ternion+1)? I hadn't seen any parse results comparing the two options. Hell, there's also the argument of offhanding Sequence for total DPS if it reduces the number of hits required to get to Sanguine Blade usage...I'm just curious as to which option will lend itself best to your best overall DPS numbers, not just crazy enspell results.
Most of the "enspell" builds I see are so low in melee accuracy I just don't see how they're functional on legit endgame content unless you're being buffed differently than the other melees in your party- i.e. receiving 2 madrigals when your standard DDs are only getting 1 or a Hunter's Roll vs Chaos. I'm not saying anyone here who is running with this build and weapon is wrong. I'm just curious to see some concrete parses along with stating the buffs they're getting and on what content. Looking for help regarding purchase decisions.
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By Aerix 2019-03-06 16:46:26
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »question: is it better to aim for an improvement to each individual enspell hit (through an offhand like kaja knife if accuracy needed or malevolence if accuracy not) or improve the number of of hits over time (through an offhand like ternion+1)? I hadn't seen any parse results comparing the two options. Hell, there's also the argument of offhanding Sequence for total DPS if it reduces the number of hits required to get to Sanguine Blade usage...I'm just curious as to which option will lend itself best to your best overall DPS numbers, not just crazy enspell results.
Most of the "enspell" builds I see are so low in melee accuracy I just don't see how they're functional on legit endgame content unless you're being buffed differently than the other melees in your party- i.e. receiving 2 madrigals when your standard DDs are only getting 1 or a Hunter's Roll vs Chaos. I'm not saying anyone here who is running with this build and weapon is wrong. I'm just curious to see some concrete parses along with stating the buffs they're getting and on what content. Looking for help regarding purchase decisions.
Kaja Knife and Malevolence are primarily used to buff Sanguine Blade damage (though the MAcc for Enspells is important too). With Temper II adding +33% TA (ideally), you can focus your gear more toward Accuracy, STP and Enspell+, generally, as adding more and more TA has diminishing returns. Ternion+1 is still great if you're going for physical DD though because of all the relevant stats and incredibly low Delay.
Sequence in offhand doesn't really add much except Store TP+10 and much higher delay, reducing the amount of overall hits you get between WSs, meaning fewer Enspell procs, without really improving your WS frequency. Several of the gear sets I posted already had 11-hit builds before SAM roll and it would have taken like 13+ STP with Malevolence offhand to get to the next tier, which isn't really worthwhile to do.
And I'm not sure where you are seeing all those low Accuracy Enspell builds, because most of them usually use a lot of Ayanmo+2 pieces for large amounts of Acc+MAcc together. Composure also adds another +70 Accuracy. My standard Enspell TP set has around 1230ish Accuracy including Composure but before food/buffs, which is more than enough for almost any content, especially if you factor in Distract III.
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3753
By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2019-03-06 18:22:17
Thanks for those comments, Aerix. 1200+ is often what I aim for in my base acc sets on other DD jobs so glad to hear its possible pre-food/etc. I saw the inclusion of Ayanmo+2 gear which I definitely appreciate the melee accuracy on those pieces...there were just other sets posted with things like Anu Torque, Dedition Earring and multiple pieces of Taeon that gave me the heebie jeebies. Sets posted based more in Ayanmo+2 and Volte give me a lot more comfort in the accuracy front.
In addition, the diminishing return of multiattack is often something I don't think about, and certainly not something that directly comes to mind factoring in Temper II.
Bahamut.Agerine
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 433
By Bahamut.Agerine 2019-03-06 18:38:22
Is the idea that 30-33% Triple Attack from TemperII is more than enough multi hit? Not sure I understand the idea of how adding more gives a diminishing Return when War just goes crazy with stacking Double attack. I am still freshish on learning melee mechanics.
Asura.Saevel
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9986
By Asura.Saevel 2019-03-06 19:24:52
Is the idea that 30-33% Triple Attack from TemperII is more than enough multi hit? Not sure I understand the idea of how adding more gives a diminishing Return when War just goes crazy with stacking Double attack. I am still freshish on learning melee mechanics.
MA in general has diminishing returns
Adding 10DA to 0
100 hits with +0 DA is 100 hits.
100 hits with +10 DA is 110 hits.
110/100 = 10% improvement, so +10 DA for 10% improvement.
Now lets have 50 already.
100 hits with +50 DA is 150 hits.
100 hits with +60 DA is 160 hits.
160/150 = 6.66% improvement, so +10 DA for 6.665 improvement.
That is what diminishing returns are, each increment adds less as a percentage over the previous increment. It's still adding but the effect is less while the opportunity cost (of not having something else in that slot) remains the same.
As for WAR's and DA, it's because they can easily get humongous amounts of it, so much that it's easily possible to hit 100% DA while rocking a 5-hit without buffs, 3 or 4 hit with buffs. They still put QA and TA, but only if it's enough to justify not having the amounts of DA in those slots. THF's are similar with how much TA they easily have access to. RDM has Temper II but the rest of their melee gear doesn't have many powerful TA options.
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By Aerix 2019-03-06 20:19:48
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Thanks for those comments, Aerix. 1200+ is often what I aim for in my base acc sets on other DD jobs so glad to hear its possible pre-food/etc. I saw the inclusion of Ayanmo+2 gear which I definitely appreciate the melee accuracy on those pieces...there were just other sets posted with things like Anu Torque, Dedition Earring and multiple pieces of Taeon that gave me the heebie jeebies. Sets posted based more in Ayanmo+2 and Volte give me a lot more comfort in the accuracy front.
In addition, the diminishing return of multiattack is often something I don't think about, and certainly not something that directly comes to mind factoring in Temper II.
That 1230ish Accuracy Enspell set actually uses Anu Torque, Dedition Earring and multiple pieces of Taeon, including Orpheus's Sash which has no Accuracy either:
ItemSet 365035
There's +Accuracy on Crocea, Kaja Knife, Ginsen, Taeon (Accuracy/Attack+20, Triple Attack+2, STR/DEX+7), Ayanmo+2, Chirich Rings, Cape, Carmine Path B. Adding even more isn't really worth it (this is supposed to be the low Acc set), so low/minus Accuracy gear with good offensive stats is a good choice.
[+]
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 162
By Shiva.Cziella 2019-03-06 20:21:59
People seeing high enspell dmg in Jeuno, it's the zone's gimmick, mobs take enhanced single target damage at the cost of no enfeebles or AoE dmg, etc.
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