|
Do you think America has a war on Christmas?
[+]
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6,709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-12-24 14:17:40
Asura.Floppyseconds said: »Asura.Floppyseconds said: »It is not about what I celebrate. You don't know anything about the other person. So instead of being presumptuous you can say happy holidays as there are other holidays.
I wouldn't tell an orthodox Jew "Merry Christmas" because that is just silly. I might as well ask him if he likes bacon and shrimp.
Your argument comes down to "don't wish someone a holiday if they don't celebrate it".
How do you know anyone celebrates any holiday? Some people don't celebrate st patricks day, are you not suppose to say happy st patty's day when it's st patty's day? Some people hate valentines day, so that means you shouldn't wish anyone a happy valentines day?
Do people still say happy holidays on new year's eve?
I don't celebrate St Patrick's day because St Patrick was a ***. Same for Columbus.
Anyway, yes New Years is part of the "Happy Holidays" line as its only 6 days apart.
What is wrong with not wishing people this or that? We don't tell Europeans "Happy Thanksgiving" or "4th of July" because that is just silly.
We have plenty of nondenominational holidays like the three just mentioned. I just personally don't want to be presumptuous as I am one of those who doesn't give a rats *** about the ridiculous nativity scenes people put up.
I am not saying there is anything wrong with sending warm regards, but in a global society within America in December. There is more than Santa going on.
Well there we have it folks. He's offended at St Patrick's Day and Columbus Day, so keep it to yourself.
I would wish any foreigner a happy fourth of July.
I don't get offended when people wish me a happy Haunnaka. I don't really say it back because I don't really celebrate them. However, it's entirely appropriate from one person to say Merry christmas and the other to respond with Happy Haunnaka.
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 8,022
By Shiva.Viciousss 2015-12-24 14:31:50
He never said he was offended by it. I think Columbus Day is a joke because the guy got lost and discovered an inhabited island. That doesn't mean it offends me.
Phoenix.Xantavia
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 449
By Phoenix.Xantavia 2015-12-24 14:35:05
I take offense at the people who wish me a Merry Christmas/Happy Holidays on the 25th, followed up by a "It's a shame that make you work today. Smile, its Christmas. Now gimme two tickets for Star Wars"
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 661
By Phoenix.Demonjustin 2015-12-24 14:43:12
Another one who doesn't get it.
You're not endorsing someone's holiday when you wish them a merry Christmas, you're telling them you are celebrating Christmas. When you wish someone a happy birthday you're celebrating their birthday. That comparison is complete ***...
I walk up to you, I say Merry Christmas, and going by what you said, I'm informing you that I am celebrating Christmas.
I walk up to you, I say happy birthday, and apparently, I am informing you that I am celebrating my birthday? No, no I'm not, no one says that.
Generally, when you say "happy/merry something" you're hoping that they enjoy that specific occasion, not that you're celebrating that occasion yourself. By saying Merry Christmas, you're wishing them to have a Merry Christmas, but if they don't celebrate the day it's little different than saying merry Tuesday. It shouldn't be offensive, but it also isn't quite normal nor what you actually meant. This is the reason Happy Holidays works much more effectively, because you're wishing them to enjoy their holiday regardless of what it is.
Quote: The reason people say happy holidays instead of saying merry Christmas is because there are people who are simply offended at Christmas. Yes they do exist, but in a country where over 95% of people celebrate the holiday, it's stupid that we need to water it down a bit as to not offend anyone. As I said, they're morons. I don't know what more need be said.
I say Happy Holidays, why? Because I like to include everyone and have no religious ties to any holiday, so why not do so? If you wanna say Merry Christmas then do so, I don't care, nor should anyone else.
Bismarck.Magnuss
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 28,615
By Bismarck.Magnuss 2015-12-24 15:31:44
[+]
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6,709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-12-24 16:17:00
Phoenix.Demonjustin said: »Another one who doesn't get it.
You're not endorsing someone's holiday when you wish them a merry Christmas, you're telling them you are celebrating Christmas. When you wish someone a happy birthday you're celebrating their birthday. That comparison is complete ***...
I walk up to you, I say Merry Christmas, and going by what you said, I'm informing you that I am celebrating Christmas.
I walk up to you, I say happy birthday, and apparently, I am informing you that I am celebrating my birthday? No, no I'm not, no one says that.
Generally, when you say "happy/merry something" you're hoping that they enjoy that specific occasion, not that you're celebrating that occasion yourself. By saying Merry Christmas, you're wishing them to have a Merry Christmas, but if they don't celebrate the day it's little different than saying merry Tuesday. It shouldn't be offensive, but it also isn't quite normal nor what you actually meant. This is the reason Happy Holidays works much more effectively, because you're wishing them to enjoy their holiday regardless of what it is.
Quote: The reason people say happy holidays instead of saying merry Christmas is because there are people who are simply offended at Christmas. Yes they do exist, but in a country where over 95% of people celebrate the holiday, it's stupid that we need to water it down a bit as to not offend anyone. As I said, they're morons. I don't know what more need be said.
I say Happy Holidays, why? Because I like to include everyone and have no religious ties to any holiday, so why not do so? If you wanna say Merry Christmas then do so, I don't care, nor should anyone else. If you tell someone "Happy Birthday" you are celebrating their birthday.
If you tell someone "merry Christmas" again you are the one celebrating the event.
Do you say happy holidays on new years eve?
Bismarck.Magnuss
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 28,615
By Bismarck.Magnuss 2015-12-24 16:22:08
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6,709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-12-24 16:35:37
Asura.Floppyseconds said: »Never said the days offend me and everyone should keep it to themselves.
How is it not rude of you to not really say anythong back when those great Jewish vibes and warm wishes come your way, Nausi? It is just about wishing someone well right?!
See I also don't want to be wished a happy Ramadan for example because I'm not a Muslim and it is stupid.
It doesn't offend me or anything. Not much really does, but I would rather someone just wished me a good *** day/weekend instead.
Because it isn't rude of me to not recognize or celebrate any particular holiday.
By Jassik 2015-12-24 16:44:38
If you tell someone "Happy Birthday" you are celebrating their birthday.
If you tell someone "merry Christmas" again you are the one celebrating the event.
Do you say happy holidays on new years eve?
While I don't necessarily disagree, birthdays and new years are both secular holidays.
At least in the case of Christmas, the way Americans celebrate it has as much to do with the religious holiday as it does with auto-repair.
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 661
By Phoenix.Demonjustin 2015-12-24 16:51:08
If you tell someone "Happy Birthday" you are celebrating their birthday. Weird, I thought it meant you were wishing them a happy birthday, which is why they generally say thank you in return.
Quote: If you tell someone "merry Christmas" again you are the one celebrating the event. I thought you were wishing them good tidings in regards to Christmas, not simply saying "I am celebrating Christmas".
Quote: Do you say happy holidays on new years eve? Up to, and on, yeah. I tend to say it regarding every holiday from Thanksgiving through New Years, past that they're too spread.
Leviathan.Chaosx
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20,284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-12-24 16:55:22
Bahamut.Ravael
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13,643
By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-12-24 16:56:49
At least in the case of Christmas, the way Americans celebrate it has as much to do with the religious holiday as it does with auto-repair.
That's not true. I'm pretty sure there's an account in the Bible of the Wise Men trampling each other and fistfighting over who gets to purchase the last Balaam's Donkey Action Figure in stock. You can't beat those day-after-Rosh-Chodesh-Kislev deals, man.
[+]
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6,709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-12-24 17:00:41
At least in the case of Christmas, the way Americans celebrate it has as much to do with the religious holiday as it does with auto-repair.
That's not true. I'm pretty sure there's an account in the Bible of the Wise Men trampling each other and fistfighting over who gets to purchase the last Balaam's Donkey Action Figure in stock. You can't beat those day-after-Rosh-Chodesh-Kislev deals, man. Tickle me Jebediah
Garuda.Chanti
Server: Garuda
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11,650
By Garuda.Chanti 2015-12-24 17:30:39
Asura.Floppyseconds said: »....
I wouldn't tell an orthodox Jew "Merry Christmas" because that is just silly. I might as well ask him if he likes bacon and shrimp. There is a great Xmas tradition among us Jews of going out to Chinese restaurants for dinner. There are two reasons for this.
1, They are open.
2, A chance to eat treif. Which means unclean. (Kosher translates to clean.)
All my orthodox uncles used to love to eat oysters at Conney Island, and shrimp is some kind of stereotypical food for Jewish Princess. Hint, both are treif.
Many of us do celebrate Xmas. My personal problems with Xmas come from having been forced to "celebrate" it in public school.
By fonewear 2015-12-24 18:33:25
By fonewear 2015-12-24 18:35:38
How the Grinch stole climate change a modern take on a Dr. Seuss classic !
[+]
Garuda.Chanti
Server: Garuda
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11,650
By Garuda.Chanti 2015-12-24 18:42:30
Wrong thread Fone, should be in AGW Theory - Discussion.
Indeed I think I will copypasta it there.
By fonewear 2015-12-24 18:53:27
That is true but all roads lead to global warming !
By fonewear 2015-12-24 18:54:09
The happy holidays to me is fine but to me a holiday makes me think of Holiday Inn...which isn't too happy !
Garuda.Chanti
Server: Garuda
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11,650
By Garuda.Chanti 2015-12-24 19:07:25
The happy holidays to me is fine but to me a holiday makes me think of Holiday Inn...which isn't too happy ! One of the two worst hotel / motel experiences of my entire life was in a Holiday Inn.
Some fricking holiday....
[+]
By fonewear 2015-12-24 19:33:14
When I think of holiday I think of vacation like going somewhere warm too. Not necessarily of Christmas.
By Jassik 2015-12-24 21:26:10
I don't believe in any deity but I still say Merry Christmas freely to people because I'm just wishing them well on the date "December 25th."
Just like the majority also follow a Gregorian calendar and so I wish them a happy new year on january 1st; since it's the internationally majority accepted "new year" I know that everyone will understand the goodwill I'm trying to convey etc
Really, I have never met a person who was offended by "merry christmas", I've only ever heard about them from religious people who claim they're being persecuted because they're no longer solely considered when holiday wishes and decorations are the subject.
[+]
Bahamut.Kara
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3,544
By Bahamut.Kara 2015-12-24 22:09:35
Which other holidays do you celebrate? Winter Solstice
St. Lucia's day
Yule
New Years
Many people also celebrate Adevent, St. Nicholas day, Boxing Day, and a variety of other Christian and other religions holidays that occur throughout the month of December.
Unless it is Christmas Eve, Christmas day 1., or Christmas Day 2. I wish everyone happy holidays.
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6,709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-12-24 22:27:49
I don't believe in any deity but I still say Merry Christmas freely to people because I'm just wishing them well on the date "December 25th."
Just like the majority also follow a Gregorian calendar and so I wish them a happy new year on january 1st; since it's the internationally majority accepted "new year" I know that everyone will understand the goodwill I'm trying to convey etc
Really, I have never met a person who was offended by "merry christmas", I've only ever heard about them from religious people who claim they're being persecuted because they're no longer solely considered when holiday wishes and decorations are the subject. Floppy is entirely offended by merry Christmas. He thinks anyone who says it is only thinking about themselves.
The Syrian Conflict Won't Steal My Christmas
Global Voices
Quote: This post is part of a special series of articles by blogger and activist Marcell Shehwaro, describing the realities of life in Syria during the ongoing armed conflict between forces loyal to the current regime, and those seeking to oust it.
Quote: Christmas used to have a special meaning in my family, full of spiritual and familial rituals. As children, my sister Leila and I used to take turns throughout the night watching out for Santa Claus, waiting to catch him “in the act”. I cannot remember clearly when we realized it was a trick played by our parents, or when we found all our letters to him, written over the years, safely stashed away by our parents. Even after growing up and realizing that Santa did not exist, my mother insisted that exchanging the gifts under the tree remain an annual ritual. A ritual that stopped, obviously, after she was gone.
At the beginning of December, she used to ask each of us what we needed, what we wished for, and she made sure that each of us bought gifts for the others. We would spend Christmas morning exchanging gifts and letters, after which I would spend hours upon hours getting ready. The hairdo, the makeup, the new clothes. I kept on buying new clothes—“Christmas clothes”—every year until I was 28. I used to look very colorful at Christmas. My hair would be, contrary to the norm, well styled. I used to practice using different colors on my eyelids. I would even sometimes go all out and draw a butterfly tattoo on my shoulder—“It’s Christmas!” I would then go to mass, followed by a party where Santa would show up and give us balloons and hats, and we would dance to “Jingle Bells”.
When my father died many Christmas rituals disappeared from our household. The tree disappeared, for instance, but my mother retained the rituals of love and gift-giving, as well as her insistence every year that we go out to celebrate with our friends and leave her by herself. Today I regret every time I left her alone, as a teenager, to go out to celebrate with friends.
After my sister’s marriage and birth of her first child, Christmas regained its familial flair and my mother regained her smile. The ritual of decorating the tree was revived and she celebrated with the grandchildren. The number of letters to Santa increased and we all got creative in inventing new scenarios for Santa to show up and distribute the gifts.
Then the revolution started.
The first Christmas is as ordinary as possible. I try to ignore the imminent threat and have an ordinary family Christmas, trying to ease my mother’s fears and wishes for me to stay safe.
The following year it is impossible to ignore all that. My last day in our house is New Year’s. Security forces are already on my trail because of what I was writing, and what some people—people with whom I used to spend Christmas, signing, dancing and celebrating—were writing to the security forces about me.
That day was my last day on the western side of Aleppo which, to this day, remains under Assad’s control, making it impossible for me to go there. I crossed the border into Turkey and re-entered from the liberated side of the city. To make the crossing between the two territories I had to use a fake identity and disguise myself with a head scarf. And to evade the regime's snipers targeting crossers, we had to race between the crossing’s two points. Those were the most dangerous five minutes ever. Crossing, without any goal worthy of this sacrifice except the “memory of the New Year”. Christmas as an act of resistance—I wasn’t going to let them steal my Christmas.
I crossed safely to the other side: a “Christmas miracle”, maybe. And I celebrated Christmas and New Year’s with the friends who loved me so much they took the risk of celebrating with me. I then returned to the liberated part of Aleppo, making that my last visit to my house, to those streets and to Christmas as I knew it.
At the same time that year another miracle happens in my city: my best friend survives a shelling at a new year’s party. I’m still grateful for that. The most beautiful miracle of my life.
The following year finds ISIS on my tail. It is very dangerous for me, as a Christian, to be in areas where they roam freely, kidnapping revolutionaries, first the Muslims among them. But despite the danger I insist on putting up a Christmas tree at my house. During wartime, there is no place you can easily buy a Christmas tree. I had to buy it in Turkey, at a price that I could ill afford then. I wrapped its various parts in clothing and smuggled it all the way to Aleppo. I hid the decorations inside boxes of tissues. Two hours on the road during which I feigned confidence at every checkpoint so that my clothes wouldn’t be not searched and my smuggled tree wouldn’t be exposed.
At an ISIS checkpoint at the city’s entrance a guard asks: “Who is this suitcase for?”
It’s mine. I make a move to open it but the driver answers: “It’s for the woman.”
The guard loses interest in searching it, and I pass safely into Aleppo. Another miracle? I don’t know.
I gather friends around me. Most of them are decorating a Christmas tree for the first time and even though the ritual has no religious meaning for them, they came and stayed around me to share my joy.
Jawad, the weirdest among them, says cheerfully: “Christian feasts are really nice.” And we all laugh.
Ali, my friend in the Free Syrian Army, approaches carrying a gift he wants me to put under the tree. I take it—I’m stunned with terror. A very small assassination pistol. He says: “It’s nothing. Is case they come for you,”—he means ISIS – “don’t let them get you alive.”
The thought is terrifying. It’s terrifying that someone’s love for you suggests your suicide. He realizes that I cannot kill, so he didn’t even try to convince me to defend myself. The pistol was eventually stolen, along with the laptop and other items in the house, and we never needed to use it. A miracle, again.
Today that tree lies in a house in the neighbourhood of Al Sukkari; a house its owner sealed up with bricks before fleeing to we don’t know where.
Maybe this is what Christmas is all about.
To be naïve among the people you love, defying death and loneliness.
To ignore the fact that Santa Claus is really your parents.
To brave the possibility of sniper fire so you can spend New Year’s Eve with friends.
To smuggle a Christmas tree through ISIS checkpoints.
To set goals for the New Year, knowing you cannot achieve them.
To pray from the heart that the doors do not close in the faces of the refugees from your country like they were closed in the faces of Mary and Joseph on Christmas Eve.
To try and find a miraculous way to penetrate an extremely painful memory and paint some love into it.
Maybe this is what Christmas is all about. To be naïve enough to write a letter wishing for “freedom”.
Creative Commons License
A small portrait of مرسيل شحوارو
Written by
مرسيل شحوارو
Translated by
Lara AlMalakeh This woman's Christmas I can understand.
|
|