BLM Enfeebling Question

What I see there is a complete disregard on the BLM for tryin' to land another sleepga II after knowing they don't have the time to recast. Could a sleepga 1 save that run? Sure could've, but hard to tell when the BLM didn't try. From my experience I would always throw a sleepga 1 when the mobs would wake then throw a sleepga II on top of that after waiting a bit to make sleepga worth the trouble.

It is a good bit of info at someone's expense to prove how vital a subjob can be though.

BLM/anything should know the timer on sleep and sleep 2 unresisted and start recasting sleep early according to their sub

I dunno, you seem to be missing the point about this, everyone knows and accepts that /rdm is a good sub at 75. Dasva is claiming that you shouldn't use /whm EVER. Even you admit that you use /whm in a few cases so I don't really see why you posted this.

You say that like the duration of sleep (not resists) varies with your sub o.0

He could just be saying you adjust the start of your casting time based on y our sub. Like, if you're /rdm you start casting at around 88 seconds in while /whm you start more at the 87 range.

Ah, didn't think of it that way.

BLM subs that are good and when:
/SCH~ Campaign or when you have a SMN friend around (INT boost is nice as are the JA's but you're going to die, esp Taru. All that extra damage, out casting others, and MP to cast when others rest all equal one thing: Hate on you. BLM/SCH is not a good tank, leave it in Campaign.
/NIN~ For solo ONLY. I just want to D2 every BLM/NIN I see at HNM camps or in Dyna etc etc... If you want to /NIN your BLM, go fight pets solo, gtfo of parties.
/RDM~ More solo goodness for fights that last longer than one or two nukes. Though I'd keep a RR item handy. If you are in groups, or doing event type stuff, start your casts before stated times so you don't screw ***up. If your leader is worth a damn they have already mentioned that BLM should come /whm and so you're already not in good standing.

/WHM ahhh good ol' bread and butter. BLM/WHM FTW. Sure you dont have max INT with this sub, go merit your INT (and eat a cream puff), yeah the skills for enf. arent that high, go merit your enf(and make gear macors for enf). Yah you cast slow, go get the L.earing and tell your RDM or WHM to haste you.

As /WHM you have tele spells, you have R, and RR, you have aga cures, and you can remove aliments. Not to mention you can aga buff. To top that all off, you've got the ability to bring the hole party from red the white HP a la Divine Seal. Oh, and did I mention you have more MP as well? You lose Dispel and Gavity, and really, Bind and Sleeeps should be enough for you.

Think bigger than yourself. Someone is always going to do more damage than you. What matters in a group, is the group. BLM/RDM is a selfish set up, and BLM/SCH is for show offs. BLM/NIN at events n such as I mentioned above is just idiotic.

As for the Ele debuff DoT's... Use them! Burn Choke Shock mage mobs, or Frost Rasp Drown for melee heavy parties. I used them from the time I got them. -Stats might as well be like +stats to your party... not to mention its better to open with them than your strongest nuke. >.>;

Nearly quit reading when you said merit INT and Enfeebling skill. /RDM will always have higher INT regardless of merits, and some of us aren't career BLM who can dump all our merits into BLM.

Regardless, I agree with most of your post. I do go /RDM to most NM fights unless I want -na or Erase though.

Bless you! ;P

Lol I guess no melee should ever /sam then. You benefit the group more by doing the job your job is best suited for not half assing another jobs job. And Idk how many times gravity fast cast or dispel had saved the day. Much more then a blm being able to curaga lol. Blm/nin actually has rare uses at events btw. Unless you like getting 1 shotted. And blm/sch is great for efficiency to do your job assuming your not gonna take any dmg. And for that matter keeps most the benefits of /whm. But you guys can keep going with blms as your main heal. And I will make sure I have adequate support magery... unless Im manaburning... then /rdm really is rediculously better

I don't have INT merits. BLM/WHM = 76 base INT (im not online atm, but pretty sure) and BLM/RDM = 79 base INT (I'm sure of that)
and BLM/SCH = 80 base INT (also sure)

What I was saying by meriting INT is that you would be able to reach that level of INT that you would have with a stock /RDM sub. Yes if you sub /RDM after adding INT merits your RDM will still out INT your /WHM, but most of us BLMs at 75 are aiming for a set amount of INT, not just as much as possible. Hope that clears what I had said up ^^

Right now blm/sch Im at base 80int

"unless Im manaburning... then /rdm really is ridiculously better"

It's really all relevant to the target.

No one sub is the best for all.

{Fact}

Well more meant thats one time when I couldnt care if anyone in the pt had support magic.

And I will keep doing a better job than you without relying on others as a crutch.

You sound like those people who used say they didn't want to play rdm/whm because they didn't want to main heal. Going /whm doesn't make you main heal, it just makes you more self sufficient. But I guess your solution is to just throw more people at everything because you only want to do one thing.

And btw, Brd is primarily a buffer, with a few debuffs one of which is very helpful. Anything else they do is just gravy. So in your world, brd/rdm is definitely better than brd/whm. Good luck getting that erase!

Keep telling yourself your doing a better job. And Ill keep doing a blms actual job better. Oh and rdm/blm or rdm/sch is generally better than rdm/whm. And actually almost any Ive done group wise was low man.

Lol, I could say the same back to you. As for rdm, that depends on the situation, but that's a whole other topic.

And if it's all low man, why do you keep talking about relying on other people to pick up your slack? I've given a bunch of examples where having /whm is beneficial and all you do is say, oh, but we do it like this, half of them requiring a small army of mages to do your job.

Agree.

Just like he said don't Nyzul with BLM "I use 5 DD + 1 RDM instead" lol... Like if you must have the perfect cookie cutter setup in FF XI in order to succeed at something... That's playing in brainless mode, using perfect setup to compensate your lack of skill. I did nyzul blm/whm, with 5 players + 1 afk dualbox (was just activating rune, nothing else). Only did boss runs, always won with +5~10min, never failed once.

Like when you need a healer and don't have it, can use BLM/WHM as a backup. May be less efficient that having the right job with you, still possible and if you're skilled enough, it works fine. Difference between good and shitty player is that good players can adapt to every situation with what they have (ITT = have BLM, variable is the subjob). While shitty players will always need to go with the perfect setup in order to succeed at something, like people refusing to do nyzul if they don't have shitload of DDs, people not doing DM without a BLM army, people wanting at least 2 SMN for promyvions etc...

And I perfectly know that being a BLM only. I've done pretty much everything in this game, even things where BLM ain't really suited for a fight/event. Still did these, and usually won without much difficulty.



Definitely not true in Salv. And that's prolly one of the most important endgame event now. Can't blame you since you apparently never did much.



Looking forward to hear about your solo/low man BLM achievement.

xNM ? Limbus ? Ix'Aerns ? Any other major mission/quest NM ? (lolsky don't count)

Blah blah blah. Since when was it a blms job to solo anything? And when would /whm be better then? Oh and actually when that was last brougth up I stated it. Whatever convince yourself your lack of planning or having the right main jobs is a good enough reason to make people come with gimped subs. I refer again that a blms job is to nuke. And Ive had so many more wipes because blms were healing and using status erases instead of nuking/binding/gravity/sleep then not curing. Oh and btw generally doesnt mean always

/whm has nothing to do with solo'ing, however solo'ing have something to do with the knowledge you have of your job. Knowing your limits, counting on nobody but yourself, being in uncomfortable situations with nobody at your side etc. That's also how you improve your skill.

Because reading a *** wiki and going to a fight prepared with the right setup which grants nearly 100% chance of winning won't make you become better at your job. Sure you'll get the ***done, still can leave your brain in sleep mode. As I said, it's like doing DM with a BLM army, promy with SMNs etc. When your party setup is "meh", you'll have to set up a different strategy and think about a way of winning even without having the right jobs in the party. (off course you'll still need a decent base, not gonna go against a mob immune to magic with a 6BLM setup...)

As for wiping because of BLM doing status cure, you better blame the player itself (or the party) rather than his subjob.

Yes its the player and ideas like nuking and debuffs arent what a blm should focus on. /whm just reinforces that concept with giving your more option to do that with. Solo or low man I dont think Ive ever cured on blm... generally you stop the mob one way or the other or your dead regardless of curing.

The vast majority of my blming has been in groups of less than 4. And most the other time was as DD for some NM. Because I have rdm which is a *** ton more useful if a real support job is needed.

I really can't think of a case where this has ever happened to me, lol. If nothing else, most blms are much more nuke happy then they are cure/status curing happy. I can see blms nuking when they should have been crowd controlling causing a wipe, but not really your case.

One last case because this conversation really isn't going anywhere fast. At the OP's lvl (24), rdm gets +1 int and single target bar spells, whm gets cure 2, na's, aoe bars, aoe buffs (not super important on there). Are you going to claim that that 1 int is worth more than everything you gain from /whm?

This says a lot too though, if the vast majority is done in groups of 4, chances are those are low man manaburning stuff which is very /rdm focused. There's a lot more than that out there. One of the examples I gave is sleeps in xarcabard and being able to remove your own slow. In pure manaburn situations you rarely need to care about the stuff that /whm provides, but there ARE situations where it's valuable.

At lower level it's /whm all the way anyway, for exp party at least. And for missions too (lv.60 or less). Never went to CoP with /rdm, would be completely stupid.

At 24? Not really. On the other hand why start out focusing your subs based on the healing potential. You lvl up with that impression. And there is 1 blm and sorta another I know that often help contribute to wipes even when we brought extra numbers solely on the fact that all they did was first make sure everyone is full hp then nuke. And maybe if you yelled throw in a sleep. But never a gravity cause /whm gets free RR. Way way too many wipes.

I did blm/rdm for all the cops past ouryu. And yeah doing 4200 dmg to snoll by myself when the other blm only did like 1500... back when it still had 9k was pretty nice. And wouldnt have happened /whm. Hell I had to venom pot just to get sorc ring active

Indeed it does, thank you.

It's not about focusing on healing potential, it's more of, you look at at what each sub offers you and you pick which is more beneficial to the situation at the time. That would seem to be a far more important lesson to learn than to solely focus on how much dmg you can do.

I dunno though, that's really an issue with the player themselves. If they like to make sure everyone's full hp, they would have done that /rdm anyways since pure hp healing potential is almost the same for both subs. Like I said above, working in small groups as a blm indicates you're probably manaburning those situations. But manaburn is not the only thing in the game, and in other situations /whm is useful.

I'm perfectly fine with you using /rdm for everything you do. It is a good sub and useful in a lot of places, but telling someone who's pretty much just starting to pick up the job, that one of the major subs should NEVER be used, is just going to give the wrong impressions to people.

This thread is disgusting, the OP asked something about *** enfeebling magics as blm and that led to a bunch of n00bs arguing about which subjob is most feasible?

Sorry, but if you don't have both whm and rdm at 37 you're a *** failure as a blm period.

I don't care what any of you say, you are not flexible as a blm if you don't have both and know how to work both subs effectively might as well go level summoner subs guys since you are unwilling to do ***for your alliance and or party.

A great example is Byakko as someone else posted BLM does not excel at flat out nuking here, it does decent if geared to the teeth but the extra -na spells on the DD's makes it run amazingly smooth.

Now take your 3 extra INT because in a fight like that particular one thats the only worthwhile thing you get from subjob and figure, does that make things run smoother at all?

It's all situational, and yes i blm/rdm for 99% of things but to knock someone who chooses to be more helpful as backup to the other mages in the party/alliance, well thats just ignorance.

Now back to the OP, Sorry for that rant, the only enfeebles i really used much of in standard exp parties was bio II, burn (cast it before SC -> MB, if your party is capable of making a SC) shock frost choke etc can all be useful especially at lower levels as they do lower the mobs stats but if you dont have time or mp for it i wouldnt bother.

If you think you may need to sleep mobs though DoT is totally out just keep that in mind, or at least don't do something HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE like DoT a link, lol... Or use Diaga in the main room for crawlers nest with all the lizards in it >.>

Thats about all i got.

lmao, I've seen that too often

All good points in your full post. If you've got the time and MP for the ele debuffs, do em, if no Dia II in the party Bio II. And its ele. skill based, not enf. skill as the post title my suggest.