Does Islam Require Forced Conversions?

What are you even saying or trying to convey?

It's just another H.P. Lovecraft thing. I'm tired of trying to combat religion, so I've taken to just posting my Lovecraft stuff in these threads because it's more interesting and less divisive.

And way, way, way cooler than anything you'll find in a boring old Abrahamic religious text.

Paged!

I'm just having a hard time following you. It seems like you're saying that literature and art are "something people do because they have no better use of their time".

k

K.

That really sounds uninformed even to those with the most basic understanding of the Prophet Mohammed's life before and after prophethood.

If you refuse to read Islamic literature and history to become informed about Islamic history, then perhaps you would benefit from reading an unbiased, renowned heavy weight western authority's take on Mohammed the prophet.

I would suggest reading "Muhammad: A Prophet for Our Time" by Karen Armstrong.

Blurb:
"The Man Who Inspired the World's Fastest-Growing Religion
Muhammad presents a fascinating portrait of the founder of a religion that continues to change the course of world history. Muhammad's story is more relevant than ever because it offers crucial insight into the true origins of an increasingly radicalized Islam. Countering those who dismiss Islam as fanatical and violent, Armstrong offers a clear, accessible, and balanced portrait of the central figure of one of the world's great religions."

"Islam's true purpose" - we got it all wrong. apparently the religion you and I practice on daily basis and read about is understood more by those who do not.

Makes total sense.

Dubai may be above calling out mindless drivel when he sees it, (may God bless him for exercising such restraint and patience with you), but I am not and won't.

Exodus 20:22-23 is a passage about not making false gods of silver and gold. Nothing about killing non believers.

2 Chronicles 15:12-13 was Israel repeating a covenant of loyalty to God and re-agreeing to separate themselves from the ways of the pagan practices of the nations around them shortly after rebelling (again) against God. Israel's history is full of this back and forth.

Here, the worship of some other God, other than Jehovah, was high treason, therefore meriting the punishment prescribed.

Luke 19:27 is, in context, obviously part of a parable that Jesus told. This parable is meant to illustrate what will occur when God judges the world. It is a picture of God's future just judgement, not present-day judgement by fallible humans.

God is the one who will execute final judgement - as stated by Paul in 1 Corinthians 5:12-13 and illustrated by Jesus' teaching/rebuke mentioned in Luke 9:52-55. Other judgement-day parables illustrate that it is God who will be in charge of the judgement, and there is no reason to interpret those as a command to Christians to execute judgement now.


Leviticus 19:33-34
33 “When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. 34 You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God."

Ezekiel 33:11
"Say to them, As I live, declares the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live; turn back, turn back from your evil ways, for why will you die, O house of Israel?"

Tell all of this to all of the brown people killed during the Crusades.

The Bible is used for justification for killing en masse, theft, rape, mistreatment of women, and slavery just as often as the Quran.

It's just that the the more egregious offenses have not happened quite as recently.

I love it when you quote google.

Opening post:

As it has played out in the pages of history, polytheistic Arabs were given two choices, convert or die. The "people of the book", Christians and Jews, were allowed to practice their religions but had to pay a tax. Others could be freely enslaved or killed.

But there are NO contradictions in the Quran due to "the law of abrogation" which plainly states that if two sutras appear to be on conflict the later one stands.

*Cracks knuckles*

This is a myth which claims that Islam orders its followers to impose extra tax on non-Muslims.

This is False.

Yes Islam orders its followers to impose different tax on non-Muslims, but that doesn't mean extra tax.

Muslims who are the citizens of Islam pay their TAX according to their faith, but non-Muslims who live amongst Muslims do not have to pay those taxes, therefore they must pay a different TAX, hence Jizya.

If Muslims pay tax, but non-Muslims don't, then it would be unfair.

To make it easier to understand I will relate this to US.

US citizens pay TAXES, if non-US citizens (who live in US) don't pay TAXES and still get protection under US military, and gain the advantages of US infrastructure, and US as a whole, that wouldn't be fair at all to American citizens.

In the above sense, Jizya is not an extra TAX imposed on non-Muslims. It is rather a different TAX imposed on non Islamic citizens

What, you don't think that Islam (along with all other religions out there) exists for something other than control over the believers?

Whatever floats your boats then. Don't come crying to me when you realize you are fighting in a "holy war" because some guy pissed in somebody else's Cheerios.

religion exists to try to help people find peace, you can't indict them all based on the crazy fringe, lest we all are held liable.

We don't hold Christianity accountable for the Crusades. We hold the people who did all the killing accountable.
People who were motivated by Politics and power.

I'm sorry to tell you this brother, but it would be better to hear it from a stranger rather than a friend or when contributing into a debate. To simply put it, get your facts straight and be sure to have whatever evidence you can get cause if this is the way you actually debate in real life then you will be easily chewed on and become an easy target.

Just be sure not to pause a debate to copy paste arguments or articles from google. You will seriously be laughed at.

No, I don't believe Islam exists to control. Muslims believe Islam exists to better the world by bettering communities by bettering individuals through spiritual, physical, economic and social well being and growth.

The Quran teaches us to free slaves, not get drunk, not steal, take care of orphans and the poor, give charity, respect your neighbour and treat them well, love your brother and sister and respect creation.

If that is controlling, then to hell with what you understand as freedom.

Ah, to be young and naive.

Historically speaking, all religions sought control over the people they were preaching, and all of them use the same rhetoric of peace for their neighbors through control over the region.

When Islam has the amount of power that Christianity once held, as they almost have right now, you will see the controlling aspects of religion. It is still there, but you have to know where to look for it, because it isn't as open as one may think.

beats me, but lots of people do.

who are we to belittle them for that? I might see it all as a crock of ***, but if you see it as the way to a healthy spirit / mind, why should I come out & ***on that? it matters little to you what I find comfort in.

a majority do stop there, really.

First,If I have to look for something, that often means it isn't common and easily observed.
"Exception to the norm"- this exists everywhere. Deviance is the product of choice. Those that deviate from the teachings of the Quran, be it for political gain or wealth, are not accurate representations of the faith.

As I have said countless times, perhaps one should simply read the Quran and understand it? (all of it, not just one verse taken out of context to justify their stubborn opinion)

"I reject your reality and substitute my own" - this one seems to fits almost every religion out there.

Faith is blind and everyone is hoping that having faith will lead them somewhere good.