|
|
Random Politics & Religion #00
 Bahamut.Ravael
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13640
By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-09-22 16:34:40
Asura.Floppyseconds said: »Yeah because the government is only the largest source of economic incentives...
He got the second half right too. You know why? Because they profit off of people.
Businesses profit off of people, yes. The ones that don't are called "bankrupt". Guess who else profits off of people? The government.
[+]
By Jassik 2015-09-22 16:35:47
Asura.Floppyseconds said: »Yeah because the government is only the largest source of economic incentives...
He got the second half right too. You know why? Because they profit off of people.
Businesses profit off of people, yes. The ones that don't are called "bankrupt". Guess who else profits off of people? The government.
Eh, the people OWN the government, at the very least in an abstract sense.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-09-22 16:41:47
If the government isn't an option and regulation isn't an option Who says that neither isn't an option?
Please note that most sensible people aren't against regulations themselves, they are against pointless regulations, or regulations-for-regulation's sake. Such as Dodd-Frank.
The government is supposed to protect the country in all aspects, not rule over them all.
Eh, the people OWN the government, at the very least in an abstract sense. Wait, are you telling us that people cannot own businesses now? I wonder what you classify me, as a majority shareholder in a couple of companies and a minority shareholder in several others.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-09-22 16:48:26
Asura.Floppyseconds said: »Asura.Floppyseconds said: »Yeah because the government is only the largest source of economic incentives...
He got the second half right too. You know why? Because they profit off of people.
Businesses profit off of people, yes. The ones that don't are called "bankrupt". Guess who else profits off of people? The government.
Not really.
It is more the house we pay for.
Paying taxes that the government profits off of gives me a military, social services, roads, a constitution, etc. I don't need to tell you this, but sure spin it to suit your own antigovernment agenda if you want.
Because clearly profiting off of peoples health which is creating part of the issue with health insurance in this country in the first place is exactly like the government taxing and profiting off of us.
You know who loses in the end when their health is a game of profit, right? So, are you saying it is ok for the government to do it, but not a business?
By Jassik 2015-09-22 16:50:03
If the government isn't an option and regulation isn't an option Who says that neither isn't an option?
Please note that most sensible people aren't against regulations themselves, they are against pointless regulations, or regulations-for-regulation's sake. Such as Dodd-Frank.
The government is supposed to protect the country in all aspects, not rule over them all.
Eh, the people OWN the government, at the very least in an abstract sense. Wait, are you telling us that people cannot own businesses now? I wonder what you classify me, as a majority shareholder in a couple of companies and a minority shareholder in several others.
There's no way you don't understand the difference. If you can tie your shoes, you know the difference between citizens owning the government and a person owning a company.
Bismarck.Ihina
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3187
By Bismarck.Ihina 2015-09-22 16:52:09
Don't mind me, I'm just making conservatives squirm
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/hillary-clinton-comes-out-against-keystone-xl_5601b962e4b08820d91a8f01?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592
Quote: "For me, we need to be transitioning from fossil fuels," she said, but added that it will "take time" to transition to renewable energy. "That's why I led with my two big proposals: I want to see us in my first term install a half a billion solar panels, and in my second term have enough clean power to run all the homes in America," she said.
Hillary Clinton already planning out her second term.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-09-22 16:53:03
If the government isn't an option and regulation isn't an option Who says that neither isn't an option?
Please note that most sensible people aren't against regulations themselves, they are against pointless regulations, or regulations-for-regulation's sake. Such as Dodd-Frank.
The government is supposed to protect the country in all aspects, not rule over them all.
Eh, the people OWN the government, at the very least in an abstract sense. Wait, are you telling us that people cannot own businesses now? I wonder what you classify me, as a majority shareholder in a couple of companies and a minority shareholder in several others.
There's no way you don't understand the difference. If you can tie your shoes, you know the difference between citizens owning the government and a person owning a company. Personal insults aside, there is an underlying difference, but the way you worded it, you made it sound like the government is owned by the people, which it isn't at all. Not even remotely close, abstract or not.
The government is there to (supposedly) provide services and protection for the people, but no way or shape does a person, or a group of people, have any control over it. That is the definition of ownership.
By Jassik 2015-09-22 16:58:25
If the government isn't an option and regulation isn't an option Who says that neither isn't an option?
Please note that most sensible people aren't against regulations themselves, they are against pointless regulations, or regulations-for-regulation's sake. Such as Dodd-Frank.
The government is supposed to protect the country in all aspects, not rule over them all.
Eh, the people OWN the government, at the very least in an abstract sense. Wait, are you telling us that people cannot own businesses now? I wonder what you classify me, as a majority shareholder in a couple of companies and a minority shareholder in several others.
There's no way you don't understand the difference. If you can tie your shoes, you know the difference between citizens owning the government and a person owning a company. Personal insults aside, there is an underlying difference, but the way you worded it, you made it sound like the government is owned by the people, which it isn't at all. Not even remotely close, abstract or not.
The government is there to (supposedly) provide services and protection for the people, but no way or shape does a person, or a group of people, have any control over it. That is the definition of ownership.
So voting isn't a thing... Got it.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-09-22 17:01:36
If the government isn't an option and regulation isn't an option Who says that neither isn't an option?
Please note that most sensible people aren't against regulations themselves, they are against pointless regulations, or regulations-for-regulation's sake. Such as Dodd-Frank.
The government is supposed to protect the country in all aspects, not rule over them all.
Eh, the people OWN the government, at the very least in an abstract sense. Wait, are you telling us that people cannot own businesses now? I wonder what you classify me, as a majority shareholder in a couple of companies and a minority shareholder in several others.
There's no way you don't understand the difference. If you can tie your shoes, you know the difference between citizens owning the government and a person owning a company. Personal insults aside, there is an underlying difference, but the way you worded it, you made it sound like the government is owned by the people, which it isn't at all. Not even remotely close, abstract or not.
The government is there to (supposedly) provide services and protection for the people, but no way or shape does a person, or a group of people, have any control over it. That is the definition of ownership.
So voting isn't a thing... Got it. So, are you saying that the American people vote on every single policy ever made in Washington DC? Because that's called control there bub.
I know ownership is foreign to you, as you have to have money first to own anything, but it's not a hard concept to grasp.
Also, what happened to your "Catch-all" rule thing? I'm surprised you haven't blindly reported every single one of my post because you don't agree with it find it "offensive"
Bismarck.Ihina
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3187
By Bismarck.Ihina 2015-09-22 17:04:46
[+]
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-09-22 17:06:46
Point the insult then.
Is it because I said he doesn't have any money to buy anything, or is it that I'm surprised he hasn't blindly report my posts because he doesn't agree with it finds it "offensive"?
By Jassik 2015-09-22 17:08:40
Point the insult then.
Is it because I said he doesn't have any money to buy anything, or is it that I'm surprised he hasn't blindly report my posts because he doesn't agree with it finds it "offensive"?
Lol...
[+]
Bahamut.Ravael
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13640
By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-09-22 17:09:18
Don't mind me, I'm just making conservatives squirm
You give yourself way too much credit. I'm more likely to laugh at the sinking ship planning her second term than squirm.
[+]
Bahamut.Ravael
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13640
By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-09-22 17:11:53
So voting isn't a thing... Got it.
We're not a true democracy, so our "ownership" of the government isn't exactly as much in the hands of the voters as you seem to imply.
[+]
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-09-22 17:12:22
Shhh Ravael, that's a personal insult there!
[+]
By fonewear 2015-09-22 17:15:17
Just got an Xbox one already regretting it !
Blah blah blah Trump is destroying America also !
[+]
Bahamut.Ravael
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13640
By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-09-22 17:19:13
Just got an Xbox one already regretting it !
Blah blah blah Trump is destroying America also !
Get a PS4 too!
Mumble mumble gerrymandering.
[+]
By Jassik 2015-09-22 17:21:07
So voting isn't a thing... Got it.
We're not a true democracy, so our "ownership" of the government isn't exactly as much in the hands of the voters as you seem to imply.
We are a representative democracy, not a direct democracy, true. But, that is still democracy, and our elected representatives are charged with legislating as their constituency demands. That's no different in terms of ownership than the executives of a publicly traded company. What makes the government different is that every citizen has a share of it.
[+]
By fonewear 2015-09-22 17:21:23
Just got an Xbox one already regretting it !
Blah blah blah Trump is destroying America also !
Get a PS4 too!
Mumble mumble gerrymandering.
I got PS4 already...first world problems !
[+]
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20130
By Shiva.Nikolce 2015-09-22 19:57:34
Eh, the people OWN the government, at the very least in an abstract sense....
I wan to stop you for a moment because
THIS is the government in America.
She is at the BMV making you wait four hours for your drivers licence.
She is at the tax office accessing the tax on your property
She is at the IRS picking you for an audit because she thinks you name looks funny
and she is denying you a marriage licence because she is a bigot.
But she is the government you begged for, she is our government you thought would solve our problems, she is the reason for it's incompetence and the answer to why things can never get done.
I know you want european socialism in the usa but it will never work here because there aren't any europeans left here...they all went back home
OUR government workers are all this woman and thirty million walmart shopping, kardasian watching, american public school attending, real housewives of wherever dumbfounded dipshits just like her....
she is the reason I am a repulican.
thank you
By Jassik 2015-09-22 20:03:07
I didn't say I want european socialism, I'm just sick of any idea that isn't "free market" being labeled socialism/communism (lol) and immediately dismissed in favor of status quo dysfunction.
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20130
By Shiva.Nikolce 2015-09-22 20:11:24
you're old enough now to learn to hate change!
dysfunction = good
change = bad
[+]
By Jetackuu 2015-09-22 20:13:44
So voting isn't a thing... Got it.
We're not a true democracy, so our "ownership" of the government isn't exactly as much in the hands of the voters as you seem to imply.
We are a representative democracy, not a direct democracy, true. But, that is still democracy, and our elected representatives are charged with legislating as their constituency demands. That's no different in terms of ownership than the executives of a publicly traded company. What makes the government different is that every citizen has a share of it.
Elected officials are supposed to do what they find best for their constituency, not necessarily what they desire/demand.
At least good ones would.
By Jetackuu 2015-09-22 20:16:45
Would be easier to power everything with nuclear, could cut down on the insane amount of coal plants that we have in the US too.
[+]
By fonewear 2015-09-22 20:17:24
you're old enough now to learn to hate change!
dysfunction = good
change = bad
I still drive a 32 Stutz Bearcat I too hate change !
By Jassik 2015-09-22 20:19:17
So voting isn't a thing... Got it.
We're not a true democracy, so our "ownership" of the government isn't exactly as much in the hands of the voters as you seem to imply.
We are a representative democracy, not a direct democracy, true. But, that is still democracy, and our elected representatives are charged with legislating as their constituency demands. That's no different in terms of ownership than the executives of a publicly traded company. What makes the government different is that every citizen has a share of it.
Elected officials are supposed to do what they find best for their constituency, not necessarily what they desire/demand.
At least good ones would.
Yes and no. The reason we have representative democracy is partly because the drafters felt the general public wasn't educated enough to know what was best for them (which is still true) but also because direct democracy in such a large area in the era was nearly impossible. A critical vote could take weeks or months to tally and not all citizens could be included. Now-a-days, we're more connected to our officials than ever, and they are at the mercy of public opinion. Plus, with the prevalence of information, voters theoretically can be more informed than ever before (even if they choose not to be).
By Jetackuu 2015-09-22 20:25:57
While those are points, and certainly plausible I'd have to disagree. Mostly due to the reason we're a Constitutional Republic over a democracy in general anyway, and that's to protect the rights of the minority over the will of the majority.
Elected representatives have a duty to their electorate, whether they like what they do or not. Now I'm not saying that they actually pull it off, and I for the life of me can't think of the last example, but I can certainly think of examples where it should be used (or should have).
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3686
By Phoenix.Amandarius 2015-09-22 20:29:55
An idiotic pipe dream claiming to run every home in America on clean energy in 4 years should make Democrats squirm. She should talk about colonizing Mars with Newt Gingrich, World Peace and a million dollars in every Americans' bank account while she's at it. Oh and a pet Unicorn for every child,
By Jassik 2015-09-22 20:31:06
While those are points, and certainly plausible I'd have to disagree. Mostly due to the reason we're a Constitutional Republic over a democracy in general anyway, and that's to protect the rights of the minority over the will of the majority.
Elected representatives have a duty to their electorate, whether they like what they do or not. Now I'm not saying that they actually pull it off, and I for the life of me can't think of the last example, but I can certainly think of examples where it should be used (or should have).
Constitutional republic and representative democracy aren't mutually exclusive. ^_^
Random Politics & Religion is for topics that aren't thread worthy on their own and do not have their own existing thread.
Rules and Guidelines
Forum Rules and P&R Section Guidelines still apply.
Satire is tolerated.
If your topic covers a story over 6 months old (Watergate, Benghazi, 2012 Election, etc.) post it here.
Discussions on racism, homophobia, transphobia, and the like are allowed, targeted insults based on these will not be tolerated.
Political debates get heated and are meant to be intense, if you take offense to being called or proven wrong, you don't belong here.
If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen; if you prove you can't handle the criticism you bring upon yourself in this thread, you may be removed from it. You are responsible for what you post.
Along those lines, heat is fine, but sustained, clearly personal hostility is not okay. The personal attack rules still apply. Attack positions, not posters. Failure to adhere to this will result in your removal from the thread.
This thread is NOT the Flame Core.
These rules are subject to change and modification where and when needed.
Random Politics & Religion may be mained or demained depending on the activity within at a Moderator's discretion.
With that out of the way, let the debates begin!
/bow
|
|
