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Random Politics & Religion #00
By Jassik 2015-11-06 18:25:30
Quote: Quoted Post Removed
Not to keep bringing this episode up, but no. I've only reported a handful of things in my years using this site and nothing since I've been on the staff. I've never reported anything directed at me, only things like player warning threads or images that violate the rules from AdSense.
In any case, of course there are people who abuse the report function, but it's there for a reason and whether reports are justified or vindictive is up to the moderators to decide.
 Bahamut.Kara
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By Bahamut.Kara 2015-11-06 19:01:15
Whats goin on with Ben Carson? He wrote in his book that he was offered a full scholarship to West Point by General Westmoreland (the Vietnam commander, of all people)?? Thats not how West Point works, at all. And now he is on the attack, but its in his book, soo what he is on the attack for?
Seriously?? Wow, what bad editors this guy had. This should have been caught by reporters ages ago.
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By Shiva.Nikolce 2015-11-06 19:09:38
>.>
Vic didn't read the book.
By Bloodrose 2015-11-06 19:12:34
Like all good americans should know, reading is for suckers!
Just ask Nik.
 Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-11-06 19:15:02
I read a book once.
Never again.
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By Shiva.Viciousss 2015-11-06 19:17:20
Bad editors, bad campaign staff. The fact that no one on the staff caught this tall tale is pretty surprising. And with him calling out Politico for questioning it is not how you run damage control, especially since its in his book, they didn't just make it up.
Just come out and admit you stretched the story a little bit to sell more copies, say you were encouraged to apply for West Point, with his standing in his ROTC class a nomination was within reach, something like that. But claiming a four star offered you a scholarship? Didn't happen. There are no West Point scholarships. And it won't be hard to find out whether the meeting even took place.
By Bloodrose 2015-11-06 19:19:33
I read a book once.
Never again. Sounds like a good read.
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Bahamut.Kara
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By Bahamut.Kara 2015-11-06 20:23:48
Bad editors, bad campaign staff. The fact that no one on the staff caught this tall tale is pretty surprising. And with him calling out Politico for questioning it is not how you run damage control, especially since its in his book, they didn't just make it up.
Just come out and admit you stretched the story a little bit to sell more copies, say you were encouraged to apply for West Point, with his standing in his ROTC class a nomination was within reach, something like that. But claiming a four star offered you a scholarship? Didn't happen. There are no West Point scholarships. And it won't be hard to find out whether the meeting even took place. Too many people are aware of how this process works. This tale shoule have been caught much quicker.
Also this
Quote: Carson has said he turned down the supposed offer of admission because he knew he wanted to be a doctor and attending West Point would have required four years of military service after graduation.
Did no one tell him there were doctors in the military? One of the advantages touted by recruiters is that residency is paid, unlike many hospitals
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By Jassik 2015-11-06 20:35:37
Bad editors, bad campaign staff. The fact that no one on the staff caught this tall tale is pretty surprising. And with him calling out Politico for questioning it is not how you run damage control, especially since its in his book, they didn't just make it up.
Just come out and admit you stretched the story a little bit to sell more copies, say you were encouraged to apply for West Point, with his standing in his ROTC class a nomination was within reach, something like that. But claiming a four star offered you a scholarship? Didn't happen. There are no West Point scholarships. And it won't be hard to find out whether the meeting even took place.
It's more than that, he said it on TV. Though, I think this is honestly a case of semantics. It's pretty clear based on the statements from West Point and former admissions people that he if he had pursued it, he would have had a great chance. I'm more concerned about his poor damage control and obvious lack of foresight.
By Ramyrez 2015-11-06 20:48:26
It's more that he's batshit *** crazy. He's his own little cult of personality and has bought into his own hype for years. He was a brilliant neurosurgeon and like anyone talented and lauded for it, he probably surrounded himself with a cadre of sycophants and lost the ability to separate fantasy from reality.
By Jassik 2015-11-06 20:59:20
It's more that he's batshit *** crazy. He's his own little cult of personality and has bought into his own hype for years. He was a brilliant neurosurgeon and like anyone talented and lauded for it, he probably surrounded himself with a cadre of sycophants and lost the ability to separate fantasy from reality.
In a lot of industries, ego is important. If a surgeon isn't confident and egocentric, they're going to second guess things in critical moments, they aren't going to push the edge of what's possible in healing people, and they are certainly more susceptible to burnout and self-destructive behavior. I don't think those traits make for a good president, necessarily, though they do have their purpose.
I think Carson's biggest problem is his need to appeal to everyone including the more radical elements in the Republican constituency.
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-11-06 21:00:43
Bad editors, bad campaign staff. The fact that no one on the staff caught this tall tale is pretty surprising. And with him calling out Politico for questioning it is not how you run damage control, especially since its in his book, they didn't just make it up.
Just come out and admit you stretched the story a little bit to sell more copies, say you were encouraged to apply for West Point, with his standing in his ROTC class a nomination was within reach, something like that. But claiming a four star offered you a scholarship? Didn't happen. There are no West Point scholarships. And it won't be hard to find out whether the meeting even took place.
It's more than that, he said it on TV. Though, I think this is honestly a case of semantics. It's pretty clear based on the statements from West Point and former admissions people that he if he had pursued it, he would have had a great chance. I'm more concerned about his poor damage control and obvious lack of foresight.
Well, things like this reinforce my decision to rarely use the word "smart" or "intelligent" when referring to people. This isn't the first time that I've seen someone who is brilliant in one field but leaves me blinking in disbelief over something stupid they've said or done.
By Ramyrez 2015-11-06 21:05:26
It's more that he's batshit *** crazy. He's his own little cult of personality and has bought into his own hype for years. He was a brilliant neurosurgeon and like anyone talented and lauded for it, he probably surrounded himself with a cadre of sycophants and lost the ability to separate fantasy from reality.
In a lot of industries, ego is important. If a surgeon isn't confident and egocentric, they're going to second guess things in critical moments, they aren't going to push the edge of what's possible in healing people, and they are certainly more susceptible to burnout and self-destructive behavior. I don't think those traits make for a good president, necessarily, though they do have their purpose.
I think Carson's biggest problem is his need to appeal to everyone including the more radical elements in the Republican constituency.
There's a line between "confidence" and "malignant arrogance" and while plenty of people sashay right past it, it is -- in fact -- a very broad and clearly-marked line.
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By Jassik 2015-11-06 21:21:35
Well, things like this reinforce my decision to rarely use the word "smart" or "intelligent" when referring to people. This isn't the first time that I've seen someone who is brilliant in one field but leaves me blinking in disbelief over something stupid they've said or done.
Yeah, I agree. He obviously was a gifted surgeon, but he's got pretty bad judgement for politics.
There's a line between "confidence" and "malignant arrogance" and while plenty of people sashay right past it, it is -- in fact -- a very broad and clearly-marked line.
I'm not saying I disagree, but I think you're simplifying the line.
By Ramyrez 2015-11-06 21:24:43
I'm not saying I disagree, but I think you're simplifying the line.
I am a little because I'm not really committed to an esoteric discussion on the topic tonight. That said, it's not that complicated of an issue.
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 Garuda.Chanti
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By Garuda.Chanti 2015-11-06 21:38:59
>.>
Vic didn't read the book. Somehow I don't think Ben did either.
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By Drama Torama 2015-11-07 09:47:07
Nuke it like you got a pair! you spineless jellyfish of a wanker's bottom!
Imagine a ffxiah where there was no garbage can to throw all our political garbage into.
It would be all over the site instead.
This is the only justification for this section. At some point it'll be less hassle to remove the section and just nuke people dragging that stuff into the other threads, though.
Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-11-07 09:50:36
Whats goin on with Ben Carson? He wrote in his book that he was offered a full scholarship to West Point by General Westmoreland (the Vietnam commander, of all people)?? Thats not how West Point works, at all. And now he is on the attack, but its in his book, soo what he is on the attack for?
Seriously?? Wow, what bad editors this guy had. This should have been caught by reporters ages ago.
The issue here is that politico reported a false story, and then the rest of the media jumped in on the hit job and proceeded with what can be called nothing but a political lynching.
Politico had to walk back the story. but not until after all the other liberal news sources had already launched their nukes. Knock knock low information voter, sorry if you're too bothered to follow politics, but we can't be held accountable for making sure you saw the revision if you already saw the mistake.
Everyone gets a "free" education at westpoint if they get in right? I guess you can pick on him for calling it a "scholarship" in his book but it still seems get across his point if it technically isn't an accurate representation of the education costs at westpoint. He's not my first pick, but if we're gonna comb over all his stuff like this, can't we at least give lying Hillary Clinton the same treatment? Otherwise this is absolutely shameful and quite possibly racist.
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Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-11-07 10:06:18
Bad editors, bad campaign staff. The fact that no one on the staff caught this tall tale is pretty surprising. And with him calling out Politico for questioning it is not how you run damage control, especially since its in his book, they didn't just make it up.
Just come out and admit you stretched the story a little bit to sell more copies, say you were encouraged to apply for West Point, with his standing in his ROTC class a nomination was within reach, something like that. But claiming a four star offered you a scholarship? Didn't happen. There are no West Point scholarships. And it won't be hard to find out whether the meeting even took place. Too many people are aware of how this process works. This tale shoule have been caught much quicker.
Also this
Quote: Carson has said he turned down the supposed offer of admission because he knew he wanted to be a doctor and attending West Point would have required four years of military service after graduation.
Did no one tell him there were doctors in the military? One of the advantages touted by recruiters is that residency is paid, unlike many hospitals
I don't think you would become a world renowned brain surgeon working as a dr for the military.
[+]
By Jassik 2015-11-07 10:29:27
Bad editors, bad campaign staff. The fact that no one on the staff caught this tall tale is pretty surprising. And with him calling out Politico for questioning it is not how you run damage control, especially since its in his book, they didn't just make it up.
Just come out and admit you stretched the story a little bit to sell more copies, say you were encouraged to apply for West Point, with his standing in his ROTC class a nomination was within reach, something like that. But claiming a four star offered you a scholarship? Didn't happen. There are no West Point scholarships. And it won't be hard to find out whether the meeting even took place. Too many people are aware of how this process works. This tale shoule have been caught much quicker.
Also this
Quote: Carson has said he turned down the supposed offer of admission because he knew he wanted to be a doctor and attending West Point would have required four years of military service after graduation.
Did no one tell him there were doctors in the military? One of the advantages touted by recruiters is that residency is paid, unlike many hospitals
I don't think you would become a world renowned brain surgeon working as a dr for the military.
World renown is over-stating his notoriety, but more to the point, many doctors are trained in the military and go on with their GI bill to get more specialized training in the civilian world. The orthopedic surgeon that reconstructed my mother's leg is a very well known doctor who started out as anb army doctor many years ago.
The reason he didn't pursue it is because it would require 4 years of military service. That's the reason he gave, and I can't believe people aren't jumping on that, because you know they would if he was a Democrat.
Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-11-07 10:49:26
I pretty sure Hillary didn't serve in the military and it's not ever talked about.
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By Jassik 2015-11-07 11:30:03
I pretty sure Hillary didn't serve in the military and it's not ever talked about.
She didn't state that she actively sought and then dismissed a free education because it required military service. And she also never claimed to have been offered by a general.
That's the new face of the Republican party.
Garuda.Chanti
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By Garuda.Chanti 2015-11-07 11:31:54
Quote: Carson has said he turned down the supposed offer of admission because he knew he wanted to be a doctor and attending West Point would have required four years of military service after graduation. Did no one tell him there were doctors in the military? One of the advantages touted by recruiters is that residency is paid, unlike many hospitals I don't think you would become a world renowned brain surgeon working as a dr for the military. World renown is over-stating his notoriety, but more to the point, many doctors are trained in the military and go on with their GI bill to get more specialized training in the civilian world. The orthopedic surgeon that reconstructed my mother's leg is a very well known doctor who started out as anb army doctor many years ago.
The reason he didn't pursue it is because it would require 4 years of military service. That's the reason he gave, and I can't believe people aren't jumping on that, because you know they would if he was a Democrat. My uncle graduated med school early in WWII. He immediately enlisted. Back them a brand new MD became an instant captain (I think major today) and it covers both internship and residency.
But it isn't just 4 years for commissioned officers. Once you accept that commission its inactive reserves (at least) for LIFE.
My uncle was active reserves. Early in '64 he was promoted to full bird colonel, was a training surgeon and a high end hospital administrator. He sweated Viet Nam as hard as any 18 year old boy I knew.
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Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-11-07 11:38:41
I pretty sure Hillary didn't serve in the military and it's not ever talked about. She didn't state that she actively sought and then dismissed a free education because it required military service. And she also never claimed to have been offered by a general.
That's the new face of the Republican party.
Lying is one thing. I don't excuse any politician for that simply because "herp dee derp everyone does it", but the turning down the military education thing? Who freaking cares?
You're sifting through dirt on your right side trying to find double standards when you've got a truckload of it just sitting to your left.
[+]
Bahamut.Kara
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By Bahamut.Kara 2015-11-07 11:38:46
Seriously?? Wow, what bad editors this guy had. This should have been caught by reporters ages ago.
The issue here is that politico reported a false story, and then the rest of the media jumped in on the hit job and proceeded with what can be called nothing but a political lynching.
Politico had to walk back the story. but not until after all the other liberal news sources had already launched their nukes. Knock knock low information voter, sorry if you're too bothered to follow politics, but we can't be held accountable for making sure you saw the revision if you already saw the mistake.
Everyone gets a "free" education at westpoint if they get in right? I guess you can pick on him for calling it a "scholarship" in his book but it still seems get across his point if it technically isn't an accurate representation of the education costs at westpoint. He's not my first pick, but if we're gonna comb over all his stuff like this, can't we at least give lying Hillary Clinton the same treatment? Otherwise this is absolutely shameful and quite possibly racist. He wasn't offered a scholarship or more importantly a place in the upcoming class upon meeting a general.
Getting into West Point (or any military academy) takes more effort than meeting a general.
If he had applied and then gotten a congressional appointment could he have gotten in to West Point? Probably.
I would like you to point out anywhere in my statement where I called him a liar or made derogatory or racist comments. In fact I'm more disappointed with his editors and all reporters than anyone else. Which is what I stated.
Too many people are aware of how this process works. This tale shoule have been caught much quicker.
Also this
Quote: Carson has said he turned down the supposed offer of admission because he knew he wanted to be a doctor and attending West Point would have required four years of military service after graduation.
Did no one tell him there were doctors in the military? One of the advantages touted by recruiters is that residency is paid, unlike many hospitals
I don't think you would become a world renowned brain surgeon working as a dr for the military. How do you know?
Are you implying that working in the military means you are somehow a subpar, unqualified person? That graduating from West Point and other military academies is a low achievement or that no alumni from those institutions became "famous"?
This was during the vietnam war. The experience doctors and surgeons were getting "on the ground" was immense.
Edited
Bahamut.Kara
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By Bahamut.Kara 2015-11-07 11:42:49
My uncle graduated med school early in WWII. He immediately enlisted. Back them a brand new MD became an instant captain (I think major today) and it covers both internship and residency.
But it isn't just 4 years for commissioned officers. Once you accept that commission its inactive reserves (at least) for LIFE.
My uncle was active reserves. Early in '64 he was promoted to full bird colonel, was a training surgeon and a high end hospital administrator. He sweated Viet Nam as hard as any 18 year old boy I knew. What?
Comissioned officers aren't required to serve life or 20 years
Nevermind. Mis-read active vs inactive IRR
Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2015-11-07 11:45:16
>.>
Vic didn't read the book. YouTube Video Placeholder
By Jassik 2015-11-07 11:46:39
I pretty sure Hillary didn't serve in the military and it's not ever talked about. She didn't state that she actively sought and then dismissed a free education because it required military service. And she also never claimed to have been offered by a general.
That's the new face of the Republican party.
Lying is one thing. I don't excuse any politician for that simply because "herp dee derp everyone does it", but the turning down the military education thing? Who freaking cares?
You're sifting through dirt on your right side trying to find double standards when you've got a truckload of it just sitting to your left.
I'm not combing for anything. I saw the politico story early yesterday morning, read it, and went on with my day. It was brought up in this thread and I again dismissed it, if you read my post earlier, you'll see I don't really care about it and even said so.
The point is, and the only reason I have even talked further about it, that people are defending him who would call anyone in the left a coward and a liar if they did the same thing.
By Jassik 2015-11-07 11:48:54
My uncle graduated med school early in WWII. He immediately enlisted. Back them a brand new MD became an instant captain (I think major today) and it covers both internship and residency.
But it isn't just 4 years for commissioned officers. Once you accept that commission its inactive reserves (at least) for LIFE.
My uncle was active reserves. Early in '64 he was promoted to full bird colonel, was a training surgeon and a high end hospital administrator. He sweated Viet Nam as hard as any 18 year old boy I knew. What?
Comissioned officers aren't required to serve life or 20 years
I don't know if it's still the case, but any enlisted man (person) could be recalled to active duty if their specialty was in dire need. That might just be in time of war or it might have been a period.
Bahamut.Kara
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Posts: 3544
By Bahamut.Kara 2015-11-07 11:51:32
My uncle graduated med school early in WWII. He immediately enlisted. Back them a brand new MD became an instant captain (I think major today) and it covers both internship and residency.
But it isn't just 4 years for commissioned officers. Once you accept that commission its inactive reserves (at least) for LIFE.
My uncle was active reserves. Early in '64 he was promoted to full bird colonel, was a training surgeon and a high end hospital administrator. He sweated Viet Nam as hard as any 18 year old boy I knew. What?
Comissioned officers aren't required to serve life or 20 years
I don't know if it's still the case, but any enlisted man (person) could be recalled to active duty of their specialty was in dire need. That might just be in time of war or it might have been a period. Yeah, I think I mis-read at first. IRR. I'll edit
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