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U.S. Climate Has Already Changed, Study Finds
Bismarck.Ramyrez
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By Bismarck.Ramyrez 2014-05-09 13:09:43
Is it bad that I'd seriously consider hooking my computer up to my bike in a generator stand (assuming such a thing exists) in order to operate it? Not to me.... But I want to build a power plant made of giant hamster wheel generators and force poor people to walk in them eight hours a day to get government assistance... mu to the haha with a hahaha and then a thunderclap boom
Just pay them minimum wage. If you make them receive government funds for doing something, they're government employees and they're going to be union.
And according to every conservative politician I've heard speak, Unions are no less than the love child of Stalin and Hitler, milking minimal contributions from government employees and in turn only getting them decent wages and benefits.
Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-05-09 14:24:22
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »Oh my God, Nausi posted something intelligent that I actually learned from having processed.
What I was wondering is how much gas the boilers need to keep the crops warm at night and how much that eats into the sustainability. Sure, it's a shortcut (using solar panels would cost more to profit) but how ecologically damaging is it? Does the closed system mean net ecological gains? Not using freshwater is a huge boon but if you're burning a ton of natural gas are you just shifting around the pollution? Desalinization has its own issues, which frankly, it looks like have not been addressed at this site (or at the very least not described in the article, which is pretty sparse on technical detail). One concern is discharge or reincorporation of the outflow from desalinization. If they have an inefficient desalinization process, then that is somewhat alleviated, but still has to be considered during environmental impact analyses. The input and output flow rate/volume is a problem which will scale badly with increasing distance to the water source(and sink). And with size of the installation.
They apparently combine the desalinization process with the power generation process, which generally isn't a good idea for various reasons (including maintenance and repair), rather than using a seperate closed freshwater system and a heat exchanger (since they have to condense the steam in any event). Which is somewhat interesing considering they use a closed oil-based system for transferring heat from a concentrator. Given the steam temperature, it has relatively low pressure and likely relatively high moisture (compared to most industrial steam), which brings its own problems with efficiency and corrosion. And the relatively low steam temperature may be why it isn't coupled as a closed system to a seperate evapoator; there may be relatively little energy after the turbine, so that the inefficieny would just eat any real useful transfer.
The use of a backup natural gas source is generally a good idea, since it prevents potential loss of the crop (which would make the entire thing pointless), and use of solar while using solar concentrators essentially doubles down (the circumstance where you would need the gas source would impact both the primary and secondary).
Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-05-09 14:34:25
Unplug your computers you hypocrites!
Unless it's currently being powered by you running in a giant hamster wheel shut it off, or shut your yap about global warming. Is it bad that I'd seriously consider hooking my computer up to my bike in a generator stand (assuming such a thing exists) in order to operate it? It'd make playing keyboard-intensive games hard, but otherwise should be fine.
I may have a problem in regards to bikes, though. I was watching a video highlighting hot guys who happened to be on bikes and I paused and backed up in order to look more closely at the bikes (and snobbily dismiss them, of course). For a netbook or tablet, you should be able to do it relatively easily, although not for any heavy gaming or the like. They typically use somewhere around 10-15W, and from what I vaguely remember, a untrained cyclist should be able to easily generate about 0.5-1W/kg. I want to say that professional cyclists are around 7W/kg.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-05-09 14:42:54
For a netbook or tablet, you should be able to do it relatively easily, although not for any heavy gaming or the like. They typically use somewhere around 10-15W, and from what I vaguely remember, a untrained cyclist should be able to easily generate about 0.5-1W/kg. I want to say that professional cyclists are around 7W/kg. I don't know what some of those conventions mean and instead choose to interpret it as "Someone make this possible."
By Jetackuu 2014-05-09 14:47:18
It would be rather easy to make your house more energy efficient, and self sustaining (less reliant on the grid) and honestly I wish they'd start a policy of more panels on everyone's homes instead of mass panel plants, as it would save on real estate, and bring people less reliant on the grid at the same time, so say a storm knocks out the power, yet it's bright as hell the next few days in the summer, and the heat starts to get to people, at least one would be able to use their wells and stuff to get water, and possibly keep some food good. Instead of being totally ***out of luck, or requiring a generator.
Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-05-09 14:54:55
For a netbook or tablet, you should be able to do it relatively easily, although not for any heavy gaming or the like. They typically use somewhere around 10-15W, and from what I vaguely remember, a untrained cyclist should be able to easily generate about 0.5-1W/kg. I want to say that professional cyclists are around 7W/kg. I don't know what some of those conventions mean and instead choose to interpret it as "Someone make this possible." No idea if this made it through kickstarter or not, but look here.
By Jetackuu 2014-05-09 15:01:48
I'm trying to recall how much power my computer took, I have a device that measures it (as I'm too lazy to do the math of each peripheral to see the current draw) nor would it be as accurate, as it wouldn't measure average use, etc.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2014-05-09 15:06:43
For a netbook or tablet, you should be able to do it relatively easily, although not for any heavy gaming or the like. They typically use somewhere around 10-15W, and from what I vaguely remember, a untrained cyclist should be able to easily generate about 0.5-1W/kg. I want to say that professional cyclists are around 7W/kg. I don't know what some of those conventions mean and instead choose to interpret it as "Someone make this possible." No idea if this made it through kickstarter or not, but look here. A few years ago, an immigrant to Canada, came up with a solution for his children, that gave them an hour's worth of exercise, while they played an hour of video games.
Basically, he rigged up every electronic luxury device (television and consoles) that his children used, such as the Nintendo Wii, to different exercise machines to power the electronics. Any time they wanted to play their favorite games, or watch TV, they had to generate enough power to play (sometimes while playing) them.
I'll see if I can find the article and news story
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Ragnarok.Sekundes
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By Ragnarok.Sekundes 2014-05-09 16:31:36
When can I sign up to go to another planet? No one on this one gives a ***if it gets destroyed.
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Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2014-05-09 16:36:21
Ragnarok.Sekundes said: »When can I sign up to go to another planet? No one on this one gives a ***if it gets destroyed. And you really think that's going to change by going to another?
There was a period of close to two years to sign up for the colonization effort of mars... with something like 88 passengers aged 21-60? from all over the world and walks of life.
But every time I think of that, I think of the old anime "Martian Successor Nadesico"
Bismarck.Ihina
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By Bismarck.Ihina 2014-05-09 16:38:56
This planet will be fine, it won't be destroyed.
It's just that I can't say the same for its inhabitants.
By Jetackuu 2014-05-09 16:39:34
This planet will be fine, it won't be destroyed.
It's just that I can't say the same for its inhabitants. Well not until our star goes into it's next stage, then it will just be swallowed up into that giant mass.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-05-09 16:41:38
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »Ragnarok.Sekundes said: »When can I sign up to go to another planet? No one on this one gives a ***if it gets destroyed. And you really think that's going to change by going to another?
There was a period of close to two years to sign up for the colonization effort of mars... with something like 88 passengers aged 21-60? from all over the world and walks of life.
But every time I think of that, I think of the old anime "Martian Successor Nadesico" Slap the Apple logo on the signup sheet and label the sacrificial pawns idealistic idiots suicidal Darwin-defiers people who sign up as "early adopters" or some similar bit of marketing twaddle. Tattoo the QR code for "This person is a complete poser" on their face and tell them it actually means "I'm saving the world and the species by going to Mars" while we're at it.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2014-05-09 16:42:55
At least they can say "I don't have to live on that planet anymore"
Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-05-09 16:43:36
This planet will be fine, it won't be destroyed.
It's just that I can't say the same for its inhabitants. LIFE FINDS A WAY
/cue Jurassic Park theme
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2014-05-09 18:25:55
For a netbook or tablet, you should be able to do it relatively easily, although not for any heavy gaming or the like. They typically use somewhere around 10-15W, and from what I vaguely remember, a untrained cyclist should be able to easily generate about 0.5-1W/kg. I want to say that professional cyclists are around 7W/kg. I don't know what some of those conventions mean and instead choose to interpret it as "Someone make this possible."
This plan is flawless, if you ignore all the food a person has to eat in order to maintain themselves, which requires industrial farming, which produces cow-fart methane, which causes global warming.
Ergo, Tour De' France is an ecological disaster.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-05-09 19:15:02
Cow farts are gonna make the sky fall!
By Altimaomega 2014-05-09 20:28:18
By Jetackuu 2014-05-09 21:24:08
Weather =/= climate, but I don't expect somebody without an education to be able to understand such a simple concept.
Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-05-09 21:34:58
Global cooling was never the consensus opinion and hasn't been seriously considered for decades. Global warming, climate change, and climate disruption all refer to the same thing. Context determines which is the more concise term.
Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-05-10 02:26:28
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By Altimaomega 2014-05-10 03:48:24
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Bismarck.Ihina
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By Bismarck.Ihina 2014-05-10 04:06:11
Soo...uhh...do you think you're actually convincing anyone of anything or do you just get off from publicly exhibiting how stupid you are to people?
Picture one confuses weather with climate, two distinctly different things.
Picture two shows you don't know how rate of change works.
Picture three tries to compare hundreds of millions of years to roughly a century's worth of time
Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-05-10 04:09:06
You don't even know what you're linking, do you?
Picture three tries to compare hundreds of millions of years to roughly a century's worth of time Made all the more amusing since he was criticizing a difference of 40 years between data sets earlier in the thread. Just wait until the rest of the scientific community finds out it was bested by someone who still can't figure out the possessive apostrophe. Boy, won't their faces be red!
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Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2014-05-10 04:56:37
Can we just get graphs and charts banned from this thread altogether? Depression is setting in.
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Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-05-10 09:19:03
Random at best, no correlation? You see how that 10 year running average change creeps above 0.0 after 1960? And stays there? Note the rarity of negative change after that?
Good job at refuting your own argument.
By fonewear 2014-05-10 10:03:18
Can we just get graphs and charts banned from this thread altogether? Depression is setting in.
Nope.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-05-10 10:05:10
Quote: Don’t look now, but maybe a scientific consensus exists concerning global warming after all. Only 36 percent of geoscientists and engineers believe that humans are creating a global warming crisis, according to a survey reported in the peer-reviewed Organization Studies. By contrast, a strong majority of the 1,077 respondents believe that nature is the primary cause of recent global warming and/or that future global warming will not be a very serious problem.
The authors of the survey report, however, note that the overwhelming majority of scientists fall within four other models, each of which is skeptical of alarmist global warming claims.
The survey finds that 24 percent of the scientist respondents fit the “Nature Is Overwhelming” model. “In their diagnostic framing, they believe that changes to the climate are natural, normal cycles of the Earth.” Moreover, “they strongly disagree that climate change poses any significant public risk and see no impact on their personal lives.”
Another group of scientists fit the “Fatalists” model. These scientists, comprising 17 percent of the respondents, “diagnose climate change as both human- and naturally caused. ‘Fatalists’ consider climate change to be a smaller public risk with little impact on their personal life. They are skeptical that the scientific debate is settled regarding the IPCC modeling.” These scientists are likely to ask, “How can anyone take action if research is biased?” Source
Quote: Publicists at the United Nations, Mr. Al Gore, and their supporters frequently claim that only a few “skeptics” remain – skeptics who are still unconvinced about the existence of a catastrophic human-caused global warming emergency.
It is evident that 31,487 Americans with university degrees in science – including 9,029 PhDs, are not "a few." Moreover, from the clear and strong petition statement that they have signed, it is evident that these 31,487 American scientists are not “skeptics.”
These scientists are instead convinced that the human-caused global warming hypothesis is without scientific validity and that government action on the basis of this hypothesis would unnecessarily and counterproductively damage both human prosperity and the natural environment of the Earth. Source
By fonewear 2014-05-10 10:06:16
Al Gore global warming by day super villain by night.
Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-05-10 10:15:16
Al Gore scammed you guys good.
Quote: Last year Mr Gore's venture capital firm loaned a small California firm $75m to develop energy-saving technology.
The company, Silver Spring Networks, produces hardware and software to make the electricity grid more efficient.
The deal appeared to pay off in a big way last week, when the Energy Department announced $3.4 billion in smart grid grants, the New York Times reports. Of the total, more than $560 million went to utilities with which Silver Spring has contracts.
The move means that venture capital company Kleiner Perkins and its partners, including Mr Gore, could recoup their investment many times over in coming years.
Few people have been as vocal about the urgency of global warming and the need to reinvent the way the world produces and consumes energy as Mr Gore. And few have put as much money behind their advocacy and are as well positioned to profit from this green transformation, if and when it comes. Al Gore could become world's first carbon billionaire
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http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/07/science/earth/climate-change-report.html?_r=3
A very extensive report, known as the National Climate Assessment, was released earlier this week. Nothing in the report is particularly surprising, but its presentation for the general public, here, is incredibly impressive. (Not all government website releases are a disaster!)
If hardcore technical reports aren't your thing, the highlights portion of the site breaks each section down as plainly as possible, is extensively cited, and makes no secret the level of uncertainty inherent in current findings. The site is really quite fantastic, and I would encourage anyone with genuine interest, skepticism, and/or curiosity in U.S. climate change to fuck around in it for a while. (Of course, if well-substantiated, easily digestible scientific communications aren't your thing, there's always this.)
Perhaps, the most poignant message arising from the report is summarized in this quote from the article:
Quote: The report pointed out that while the country as a whole still had no comprehensive climate legislation, many states and cities had begun to take steps to limit emissions and to adapt to climatic changes that can no longer be avoided. But the report found that these efforts were inadequate. I don't really consider myself a policy person so... what do?
Edit: Also of note is the high diversity of those involved. Largely scientists, of course, but representative of a wide swath of interests, including some oil companies.
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