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Is it Time to Remove Under God From the Pledge?
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-22 10:14:12
Replace the words "Under God" with "Thanks, Obama." That should keep everyone happy.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-22 10:16:56
Did anyone else have to recite a pledge to a state flag along with the US flag, other than KN? :/ Damn, you know too much.
/*** gun
Grab your six shooter! Toe-to-toe on the Comal!!! HIGH NOON! 5 paces or 10?
Texas does I think, but that's because they still cling to this ridiculous identity as an individual republic allied with the United States. What I find hilarious is that you are quoting a Texan, who also referred to another Texan.
Besides, I don't find your comment about Texas to be amusing. You know that Texans are very loyal to their state and country, probably more than any other citizen in the nation. This whole notion of seceding from the USA is actually our way of protesting the current administration by slapping the federal government in the face that we even brought this up in the first place. It is our way of playing politics.
But thanks for the hate anyway.
By fonewear 2014-04-22 10:17:19
How about Militant Atheist.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-22 10:17:39
Pretty sure the professional victims won't allow it. Professional victims are the ones suing in the first place.
Or is that buying into the propaganda?
By fonewear 2014-04-22 10:18:55
I got it. Compassionate Liberal. That should be on all our currency.
A rainbow and a tree on the currency.
On the other side a picture of Hillary Clinton.
Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-04-22 10:20:11
I'm pretty sure every person, place, and country has their own unique way of protesting the current administration.
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By fonewear 2014-04-22 10:22:26
Best way to protest is to not vote. That will show those fat cats in D.C. !! What better way to make a difference than by being indifferent.
Garuda.Chanti
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By Garuda.Chanti 2014-04-22 10:22:29
Waitafrickingminuet. What Dwight D. Eisenhower stitched together let no one rend asunder.
It should really be removed but suing government official over it? Come on now. This is why in the UK we view Americans as a bunch of people just looking to sue each other. We are truly the inheritors of the Athenian tradition.
Quote: By the same token God should be taken out of God Save the Queen but I'm not going to sue 10 Downing Street because I'm an Atheist. But God has been GStQ since it was written. God was spliced into the pledge in 1954.
In the Pledge of Allegiance, the words "under God" are best understood as a reflection of the simple historical fact that the Founders believed in a supreme being, and that their belief led them to dedicate the nation to the fundamental secular precept that all men have unalienable rights to liberty and justice.
Is there something wrong with encouraging patriotism? How exactly are the words "under God" patriotic?
I would remind you that many of our founding fathers were Deists and Ben Franklin claimed to be an atheist. He also claimed to be a theist but that's beside the point.
Your premise is mistaken anyway.
Quote: In 1954, Congress after a campaign by the Knights of Columbus, added the words, 'under God,' to the Pledge. The Pledge was now both a patriotic oath and a public prayer. - source.
The Knights of Columbus is a Catholic organization.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-22 10:22:41
I'm pretty sure every person, place, and country has their own unique way of protesting the current administration. How many states have their own unique way (and done it) of protesting the current administration (and their own state capital for that matter, don't forget that people from both sides of the political spectrum have petitioned to remove Austin from Texas).
Ragnarok.Tatsiki
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By Ragnarok.Tatsiki 2014-04-22 10:24:09
I don't think it should be removed, if it was "One nation, under god, not for atheists, indivisible with liberty and justice for all"
Yeah I can see that being a problem, but just because 'god' is mentioned does not mean it's discriminating. If someone's religion is -offending- another person, that person doesn't -have- to say it. Just tell the teacher "Hey I'm not a Christian so I'm not going to be saying the Under God part" if the teacher says you -have- to say it, then they can complain.
I'm a Christian, I understand we're all different, but ffs be serious here, there's no reason to -sue-.
By fonewear 2014-04-22 10:26:17
Actually better than Hillary this should be on our currency.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-04-22 10:26:29
I'm pretty sure every person, place, and country has their own unique way of protesting the current administration. How many states have their own unique way (and done it) of protesting the current administration (and their own state capital for that matter, don't forget that people from both sides of the political spectrum have petitioned to remove Austin from Texas). Without doing any research here, we got Bundy. Then there's all the republican states not accepting funds for medicaid expansion. I'd speculate there's a lot more, but that's off the top of my head.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-22 10:27:12
people from both sides of the political spectrum have petitioned to remove Austin from Texas Wut? I must hear the story on this. Being nowhere near Texas (praise the baby Jesus), I've never heard of a desire to forcibly secede Austin. Then again, my friends in TX describe Austin as one of the few places worth living in, so there's that.
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2014-04-22 10:28:01
What I find hilarious is that you are quoting a Texan, who also referred to another Texan.
Besides, I don't find your comment about Texas to be amusing. You know that Texans are very loyal to their state and country, probably more than any other citizen in the nation. This whole notion of seceding from the USA is actually our way of protesting the current administration by slapping the federal government in the face that we even brought this up in the first place. It is our way of playing politics.
But thanks for the hate anyway.
I'm just sayin, you guys wouldn't last a year as your own republic. Oklahoma would look at you cross-ways and you'd start a world war over it.
Caitsith.Zahrah
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By Caitsith.Zahrah 2014-04-22 10:28:43
Did anyone else have to recite a pledge to a state flag along with the US flag, other than KN? :/
Texas does I think, but that's because they still cling to this ridiculous identity as an individual republic allied with the United States.
Yeah. I was just curious as to how many more states, if any at all, recited a state pledge.
It should really be removed but suing government official over it? Come on now. This is why in the UK we view Americans as a bunch of people just looking to sue eachother.
By the same token God should be taken out of God Save the Queen but I'm not going to sue 10 Downing Street because I'm an Atheist.
It was my understanding that the (Any Monarchy actually) Monarchy officially is an institution of God. In which case (As an Atheist) I wouldn't make an argument that God Save the Queen is a violation of any kind. I'd argue that the Monarchy should just be tossed out, but then what Cultural export does Britain have to the United States anymore? Benedict Cumberbatch can only work so many days out of the year.
IIRC, Prince Charles was in hot water a while back for suggesting his future title would be "Defender of the Faith s".
EDIT: Not every Texan screams "Secession!" until they're blue in the face also.
How many states have their own unique way (and done it) of protesting the current administration (and their own state capital for that matter, don't forget that people from both sides of the political spectrum have petitioned to remove Austin from Texas).
It's not going to happen. :/
Both CA and CO have ridiculous murmurs over divvying theirselves up into different states, but it's not going to happen.
DOUBLE EDIT: Seriously, though. For all the goofy threads that pop up in P&R, neither CA nor CO, and their divided populous were ever discussed on here.
Sylph.Linkk
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By Sylph.Linkk 2014-04-22 10:28:45
Having kids saying the pledge is just brainwashing. They are not taught to critically think about what they are pledging their allegiance too or to compare it with what other places do. I tell my kids don't say the pledge of allegiance for that reason and also tell them not to pledge allegiance to anything until you know and understand what they are actually doing. Knowing what this country has done, continues to do and is responsible for, I am sure my kids will never pledge. So, first you accuse the pledge of allegiance as brainwashing, then you tell your kids not to recite the pledge. Isn't that also brainwashing your own kids?
Or is it ok when you do it?
How many levels of stupid you have to be? Is telling your kids not to smoke or running in a street brainwashing or protecting them? Is it that hard for you to comprehend "not to pledge allegiance to anything until you know and understand what they are actually doing." So to you, having them wait until they are well informed so they can make an informed choice is the same as brainwashing? lol I don't know if I should pity you thinking or laugh.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-22 10:31:15
IIRC, Prince Charles was in hot water a while back for suggesting his future title would be "Defender of the Faiths". That doesn't even make sense. The Anglican Church, such as it is, is a communion of associated organizations rather than a monolithic beast like the Roman Catholic Church. It actually would be correct, if slightly pointless, to use the plural.
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By fonewear 2014-04-22 10:33:50
Last I checked saying the word God doesn't make you religious. Even if it offends you.
God forbid you do or say something that offends anyone in this country.
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By Grumpy Cat 2014-04-22 10:34:55
The real question, is that if we take out "under God", what will we put in there instead to keep the rhythm?
Thunder Bob?
Wonder Bra?
Haveno Jobs?
By fonewear 2014-04-22 10:35:51
The real question, is that if we take out "under God", what will we put in there instead to keep the rhythm?
Thunder Bob?
Wonder Bra?
Haveno Jobs?
The way people worship Apple why not Steve Jobs ?
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By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2014-04-22 10:38:04
It should really be removed but suing government official over it? Come on now. This is why in the UK we view Americans as a bunch of people just looking to sue eachother.
By the same token God should be taken out of God Save the Queen but I'm not going to sue 10 Downing Street because I'm an Atheist.
Actually lawsuits have a purpose besides fiscal gain. If it weren't for a lawsuit by Edith Windsor, the Defense of Marriage Act would still be in effect.
Caitsith.Zahrah
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By Caitsith.Zahrah 2014-04-22 10:38:47
IIRC, Prince Charles was in hot water a while back for suggesting his future title would be "Defender of the Faiths". That doesn't even make sense. The Anglican Church, such as it is, is a communion of associated organizations rather than a monolithic beast like the Roman Catholic Church. It actually would be correct, if slightly pointless, to use the plural.
It may not, but he has nice, little chats with plants also.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-22 10:41:38
How many levels of stupid you have to be? Is telling your kids not to smoke or running in a street brainwashing or protecting them? Is it that hard for you to comprehend "not to pledge allegiance to anything until you know and understand what they are actually doing." So to you, having them wait until they are well informed so they can make an informed choice is the same as brainwashing? lol I don't know if I should pity you thinking or laugh. But if you consider pledging allegiance to a nation as brainwashing, then why not the refusal to pledge allegiance to a nation as brainwashing also?
Street goes both ways bub. What you consider brainwashing, somebody else can consider the opposite as brainwashing.
You completely missed my point, and I expect you to miss my point again because of your arrogance.
Ragnarok.Tatsiki
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By Ragnarok.Tatsiki 2014-04-22 10:43:01
Everyone misses the point.
Everyone is dumb.
This thread is dumb.
I'm dumb.
Good day.
Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-04-22 10:43:06
There used to be a song we'd have sing after the pledge too. I can't remember it, but I kinda remember the parody version we used to sing instead and got in trouble for.
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By Grumpy Cat 2014-04-22 10:44:43
There used to be a song we'd have sing after the pledge too. I can't remember it, but I kinda remember the parody version we used to sing instead and got in trouble for. Camp Anawanna, we hold you in our hearts!
And when I think about you - IT MAKES ME WANNA FART
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Bismarck.Misao
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By Bismarck.Misao 2014-04-22 10:45:22
IIRC, the Pledge wasn't a thing you "needed" to do, you could opt out of doing it if you wanted to in HS.
Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-04-22 10:46:42
It started off like this:
"My country got rid of me, they sent me to Germany, to see the king.
The king was Donald Duck, he drove a garbage truck..."
Don't remember how it ended, lol.
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Ragnarok.Tatsiki
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By Ragnarok.Tatsiki 2014-04-22 10:49:42
It started off like this:
"My country got rid of me, they sent me to Germany, to see the king.
The king was Donald Duck, he drove a garbage truck..."
Don't remember how it ended, lol.
*Will she take the bait?*
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A new fight started in NJ last month.
Quote: A national humanist group is suing a New Jersey school district on behalf of a family that believes the phrase "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance is discriminatory toward atheist children.
The lawsuit against the Matawan-Aberdeen Regional School District was filed in state court last month and announced Monday by the American Humanist Association, a Washington, D.C.-based advocacy organization.
The group says the phrase, added in 1954, "marginalizes atheist and humanist kids as something less than ideal patriots." The anonymous plaintiffs say those two words violate the state constitution's right to equal protection. Source
A cut and dry argument from the school:
Quote: David B. Rubin, a lawyer for the Matawan-Aberdeen district, said the district is following state law that requires the pledge to be said daily. The federal courts have upheld the constitutionality of the pledge in schools, he added, as long as students who object are not required to participate.
“We are disappointed that this national organization has targeted Matawan-Aberdeen for merely obeying the law as it stands,” Rubin said in a written statement. Source
This issue have also been raised many times before, but a similar case involving discrimination has only been presented recently. The first time was in 2013 in Boston.
Quote: Every attempt to eliminate the mention of God has thus far failed, but the Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts will hear arguments on Wednesday seeking removal of the two words for a new reason: discrimination.
"This is the first challenge of its kind" said Roy Speckhardt, the executive director of the American Humanist Association, an atheist group arguing for the plaintiffs. "We feel very confident that we have a strong case."
That case, which was brought by an unidentified family of a student at a school in suburban Boston, will be argued on the premise that the pledge violates the Equal Rights Amendment of the Massachusetts Constitution. It is the first such case to be tried on the state level: All previous attempts have been argued in federal court on the grounds that 'under God' was an unconstitutional violation of the separation of church and state. Source
So is it about time we change the Pledge of Allegiance? Are lawsuits the way to go about it? Who exactly do you sue if the school is only following the rules?
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