119 Polearm Comparison

I know there are a lot of other polearm comparison threads but I have looked through many and none seem current. I was curious if anyone had information on how the level 119 Gungnir, Ryunohige, Rhongomiant, and Upukirex compare. Any info contributed to this post would be greatly appreciated.

ryu for sure :p

I am curious if maybe the fixed Gungnirs stupid def down overwriting angon, or making it more potent or something.

Ryu is a given. I think they wanted more of a comparison.

Doubt many ppl upgraded their REMs yet. I'm 7/300 myself cuz I don't feel like paying another 70-90m to upgrade my weapon. I'll wait for pluton boxes and price of singles to decrease to like 100k before I buy anything

Instead of upgrading Gungnir you should donate your gil to charity instead. There's probably some new player starting XI who could really benefit!

I only had it in the hopes SE would finally see how gimp it is and fix the Defense Down effect and add some kind of boss stats to it. I mean they fixed mage R/E/M by adding a crapload of Magic Damage and Magic Attack Bonus! I guess I'll hold on to Gungnir for a while longer, just in case. Then again SE always screws DRGs,most recently they shortchanged us out of a 45s SP2 by saying they actually made an error for the past 4 months and its supposed to be a 30s ability(they screwed up on the teaser reveal AND the version update notes, both JP and NA). Also it's better than Upukirex and Rhongo but inferior to Ryuno so since I already have it and Ryuno is a pain in the *** for a casual player to make, might as well settle for silver :D

Even if I had 30k alexes, making a mythic is still a schlep. As a grad student, I don't have the time to do Assault/Einhjar and Nyzul every day and I don't have mules to make it soloable, I'd have to drag people to come with me which is annoying too. Relic is a happy medium because it was relatively cheaper to make and better than other non-mythic options at the time. If I was a 17 year old high school student with no prior responsibilities or job, then a mythic would be on my horizon.

Nothing that erases more potent defense down effects is better than anything else

And we really don't need to hear about your being a grad student every.single.time Ryunohige is brought up

The underling issue with Gungnir is that it's weaker than AND overwrites Angon which is counterproductive and not practical on several levels. It wasn't an issue when the weapon came out in 2004 but it became one when Angon was added a few years later.

Considering they were able to adjust the priority of Exalibur's additional effect and Enlight, I don't see why they can't do something similar for Gungnir, either by lowering Gungir's Def Down priority so it can't overwrite Angon, or by making Gungnir's defense down equal to or greater than 25%.

The reason why I can see them fixing it soon is just logistically speaking, the DPS increase for the alliance with a DRG using Upukirex and 5/5 Angon greatly exceeds the DPS of an alliance with a Gungnir DRG with the 17% defense down. That extra 8% defense down from Angon will increase everyone's damage by more than what the Dragoon's individual damage with Gungnir do for the alliance's DPS. That being said it's probably not an intentional contruct but merely an oversight. There's no 'barance' to it, stop being bitter and loldrg about it and acknowledge that Gungnir's added effect is flawed. I'm not even talking about the aftermath or WSC which are poorly thought out. The added effect of Gungnir is on a completely different level because it directly interfers with one of Dragoon's abilities. If the def down was 5% but didn't overwrite Gungnir, I wouldn't care. At least then it could proc *SOME* defense down when Angon is down. But the fact that you can throw an Angon for 25% down and then on your very next swing overwrite it with a weaker, shorter duration 17% defense down is really lousy planning. Its not even that Gungnir's defense down has little benefit, it has inverse benefit, it has detriment.

It's like what if there was a WHM R/E/M that had a special trait that "Occasionally boosts cures by 20%" but the thing is when it procs, it doesn't take into account any cure potency from gear. Or imagine if Kogarasumaru has "Additional Effect: Haste" but when it procs it overwrites Hasso with a +5% Haste icon that doesn't stack with the spell "Haste"

The only way anything gets fixed in this game is to complain about it. So the whole 'stfu and make a ryuno' argument is old because people did the same thing about claustrum and now it's a freakin amazing weapon.

Claustrum wasn't adjusted because anyone whined about it. It was adjusted because there was no way to reintroduce it as it was given the current staff paradigm.

Creating a Ryunohige almost certainly takes less time than you currently play with; You can only do so many Odins and assaults in a single day. Just make one.

And Jesus Christ stop extending your post. It's needlessly wordy enough without the addendum.

These are some fast and messy spreadsheet numbers. All weps 119. Gearsets probably aren't perfect.

Tojil.
Soulvoiced March, Minuet and madrigal x2. Ghorn+merits assumed
Rolls:Chaos, Sam, fighters, rogues

Ryunohige AM3 1489.975
Upukirex 1101.981
Ryunohige 1097.656
Gungnir 1075.139(1033.290 before relic ODD)
Rhongomiant 1020.031


Gungnir. This is inaccurate due to the relic ODD. As it only procs on the first hit of a round, entering the normal value in the ODD cell gives inaccurate results. I think I saw someone explain how to figure out how much ODD to use for relic, but I don't recall how. I used a very arbitrary 13%.

Rhongomiant. Didn't use ODD here. Last time it was discussed I think it was found that using camlann's even to trigger AM was a DPS loss.

If SE didn't care about Claustrum in the last staff paradigm, why would they care now?

Enlight has been around for at least 2 years, why fix Excalibur now?

Man and it's like from a developer standpoint, why not try to bridge the gap between R/E/M. I get the mythics should be the best but do they need to be the best by such a dizzying margin? One easy way for them to make Gungnir and Rhongo less worthless would be to just fix the added effect of Gungnir to make it stack with Angon or be equal to or better than it. Additionally, why not let ODD from relic and ODD from Rhongo AM proc on Jumps? Ryuno AM procs on Jumps and Yoichy/Annhilator procs on Barrage.


Supposedly 17% OD2.5 for Gungnir according to wiki.

Not to sound like a smart@$$ or anything, but, I doubt it. When was the last time you saw an honest-to-goodness new player on this game?

That's x2.5. The spreadsheets ODD cell uses x2. Also, that's not even the issue. Because Relic ODD only proc on the first hit of an atk round, the more multihit you have the the less accurate the spreadsheet will be. The spreadsheet ODD funtion was set up for emp ODD, which can proc on any hit.

CDF wrote up a way to convert it here but it makes my head hurt.

If anything, wouldn't trying to find the proper calculation be even more harmful to Gungnir's DPS? 13% even if inaccurate is probably already generous I would think, no?

I knew Ryuno was 1 but I didn't expect Gungnir to weaker than Upukirex. I thought the ODD would have pushed it above Upukirex's superior DMG. We'll have to wait and see the future upgrades to R/E/M to be sure though. I wouldn't be surprised if they'll let us have augment paths for R/E/M since augment seem to be a recurring theme of SoA

I saw that post Suji, and had the same issue with it. x.x;

After I get all the spreadsheets updated with the new weapons (armor is done) and Ionis, I'll work through and separate out ODD and relic damage (relic will be automatic, and will ignore the ODD value; ODD will only apply for non-relic (ie: Empy) weapons), and handle the Quauhpilli DA effects. These updates are already done on the mnk spreadsheet.

<3 so much.

Also, a strange thing I noticed while i was testing Vishap body. It appears, that store tp applies to jump TP bonus. Like, if I added enough stp, I'd get more than +3 extra TP. <,<

I wondered if that was unique to Vishap, so I checked it with lancer feet and spirit/soul jump. I got the same results. using stp I could push the bonus TP higher.

Just to be sure, do relic ODD, empy ODD, and DA bonus effects all count on all jumps?

Relic and emp ODD do Not proc on jumps.

I have no idea about DA dmg+. It didn't exist for DRG till this update. I don't have the helm, so I can't test it either.

Ok, all updates made.

im a few plutons away from upgrading Gungnir to 119 of course i have Upu and i think its a great weapon also, but yeah i was hoping to see what general consensus is on our DRG forums before making a final decision -_-.

it seems like Ryuno > Upu > Gung > Rhongo

but if the ODD on Gungnir is worked out it may be
Ryuno > Gung > Upu > Rhongo?

if Gungnir is ahead of Upu i'll be pretty happy lol

P.S. i hope one day one of us is motivated enough **stares @ Ophannus**to make a DRG 101 thread like every other job on FFXI AH has lol.

Hope to see what is best soonish to, cos im torn between the relic bow for my sam or the drg pole. I'll build my empy as soon as i have enough currency :)

I look at other job guides like Sylows and Prothescars and cry a little because I don't have the time or patience to make a guide that in depth and delving into spreadsheet math and formulas. Also formatting with gear sets and pretty colors is annoying. If someone wants to collaborate with me maybe it'll see the light of day. If not maybe ask Martel or another badass DRG to do it lol.

The almost-definitely unresolved issue of Gungnir's additional effect overwriting Angon coupled with the tendency of forums to only consider the biggest threat (Delve megabosses at the moment) when comparing things means that Gungnir will practically be below Upukirex and probably even Rhongomiant. As has been said before. Even on much lower content where Angon isn't an issue, Upukirex is a rather well-statted weapon. SE really doesn't like Dragoon for some weird reason.

B===================================================================================D Ryunohige
8========================D Rhongomiant
B========================D Upukirex
:- Gugnir
. all others

Sell your plutons and start buying alexandrite. Gungnir is officially the worst relic.