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(Don't) Fear the Reaper: A Dark Knight Guide
 Cerberus.Kylos
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4475
By Cerberus.Kylos 2024-04-29 01:38:30
Carbuncle.Samuraiking said: »Well... this guide opens with "Please don't be a R15 Calad / R0 Sakpata DRK..."
I have been exactly this for about two years now, and only because I have focused more so on Sortie and other content than Odyssey (I also took a year break). It baffles me how being a R15 Calad / R0 Sakpata DRK is a bad thing.
I had a look at the guide, and while I admire how plentiful they are, some of the sets are puzzling. You're right about random Geas Fete equipment which has no place in 2024, especially if a player has a full set of R0 Sakpata. It is old gear severely lacking in defensive stats. I've had a better time making my own sets from the damage calculator, and it feels like I should share some of those soon.
WAY too many "guides" show you what the best sets are assuming you have Nyame/Sakpata maxed, which is absolutely ridiculous for anyone looking for a guide. Nobody with gear this maxed should be needing help from anyone else (although a few might). Would anyone be interested in my sets from the damage calculator? I'd only take the time to share if there is decent interest for DRK sets.
Sakpata doesn't matter if it's R0 or R30. There is sick stuff on the augments, like the hands getting STP, but the main reason to use Sakpata is for the massive MEVA and the DT. If you play Ody and Sortie, you need to survive, using Sakpata is better than any glass cannon busllhit. It's still great DPS pieces even at R0, it's not gonna beat your Relic legs, but you also won't die as much in them.
As for Nyame, yeah, the WSD is on the augments, so if it's sub R25, you still need to use the AF, Relic and Empy pieces with 10%/12% WSD instead, and fill in your weaker Nyame in the other slots. If you are literally R0, you may have to build some Reisenjima gear with WSD rolls on them, but none of this invalidates or makes guides useless, you just don't know how to *** read them...
If you don't have said piece, look at why that piece is good and find a suitable replacement for it with similar stats. Or, crazy idea, go try to build/earn/buy it. Guides are to be used as a base, and then you build around them until you can get the gear. The WSD Calculator is great and you can use that to help you, but it's also VERY BAD if you use it wrong. If you enter the wrong buffs or the wrong mob stats, you are going to get recommended really shitty gear choices. It will bring your acc/atk up to cap if you gave the mob too much eva/def, and put on shitty acc/atk gear that you didn't actually need in-game instead of WSD or PDL stuff that would be ideal for that mob and so on.
If you can't even use a guide properly online, I wouldn't trust you with a WSD Calculator at all.
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Unrelated side tip, find an Ody group and build other REMAs. If you aren't gonna make Foenaria, make an Anguta or Mythic. You need a scythe and using only Calad isn't gonna work, especially in Sortie. It may not be easy to find a group, but this is a team-based game and you aren't gonna get any of the good gear without one. Idk how you have spent 2 years in the game without finding an Ody group and at least doing V5 or V10's. The game is, imo, not worth playing without a group. By all means, do what you want to do, you just sound ridiculous when you complain about guides not being catered to a R0, one-weapon DRK that is too lazy to get the gear you need.
You clearly don't know me. Dude, I use GS and Scythe. I have a freaking Liberator in my profile picture... and I have it augmented with sets. I have an Apocalyse, Anguta, and (lol)Ragnarok, although I only ever use Apoc if we're in serious danger.
I lead an endgame linkshell and we do events every week. I have been leading endgame linkshells for over twelve years. My linkshell has done Odyssey segment farms, but I have purposely kept us away from NMs (above V0) for several reasons I'm not about to detail here, but we are finally getting there after finishing my 10th Aeonic run.
You should know that I have shared information, experience and sets to this thread since 2012 (see page 2). I have been playing DRK as my main job since 2005. I have always been a leader of a linkshell since 2004. I have created several guides (Sortie/Assaults/Making Sets From Scratch etc.) for this forum, and made help videos to assist players. I'm not the best at making them, but I like to believe I have helped others a considerable amount, along with others helping me out when I need it. I am absolutely dumbfounded that me asking if others would like help in making sets has garnered this response.
Now, back to what I was saying about the damage calculator program. I helped the creator to refine it by giving him feedback so it could be improved. I am willing to share sets created from it with many different criteria... And no, I wouldn't post stupid sets that don't make sense, because I'm fully aware when the program gives me a dud. If anyone would appreciate this, please let me know. Thank you.
By K123 2024-04-29 01:56:12
I wasn't asking for help as much as I was just confirming the pieces I was using were right, and that the guides are in fact all junk. I confirmed that they are all junk and all the gear I am using is the best.
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Server: Carbuncle
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Posts: 167
By Carbuncle.Samuraiking 2024-04-29 02:38:25
Random, mostly meaningless ***.
Alright. Good luck with your Ody bosses.
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2024-04-29 03:17:50
Fwiw "community guide" means it's open to edits by everyone and it's a collaborative effort.
In effect, you're all equally responsible for its current state if you think it's bad.
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Cerberus.Kylos
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4475
By Cerberus.Kylos 2024-04-29 03:52:45
Valefor.Prothescar said: »Fwiw "community guide" means it's open to edits by everyone and it's a collaborative effort.
In effect, you're all equally responsible for its current state if you think it's bad.
Untrue. Community guides on BGwiki are maintained by a handful (if lucky) of people in their community. There may be some crossover from here, but it should never be assumed players on ffxiah are responsible for them. I certainly don't have time to edit those regularly, and would not expect others to either.
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2024-04-29 03:59:19
You are verifiably wrong. Anyone can log in and edit bgwiki and anyone can edit BG community guides. The ones you arent permitted to edit are the personally curated named BGwiki guides. If you aren't willing to put in the time to keep things up to date then demanding others do so or whining about how wrong it's written is selfish and churlish. I'd also like to point out that it even says in the guide why the complaints are irrelevant:
Quote: Disclaimer: The sets posted herein are a bridge gap for new & returning players. This isn't a true end-to-end High-End sets guide.
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Posts: 167
By Carbuncle.Samuraiking 2024-04-29 04:13:54
He just wants to argue. This is why I disengaged after his response.
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2024-04-29 04:17:01
Yeah that'll be my last post on the matter too, nothing else to say. If they're that passionate about it they have the tools to fix it themselves.
Cerberus.Kylos
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4475
By Cerberus.Kylos 2024-04-29 04:33:57
Valefor.Prothescar said: »Yeah that'll be my last post on the matter too, nothing else to say. If they're that passionate about it they have the tools to fix it themselves.
I get your point, although I don't think it was super wrong to point out flaws in the guide. I praised it for how many sets it has. They even went as far to add sets for axe, which is surprising. I respect the time and effort some have put in.
The problem for me is I always wanted to make a job guide, but I can admit that I'd suck at maintaining it. That's why I wouldn't want to start editing the community guide, because I'd start, but then feel bad later for not keeping it going. That's why I offered help in a one off way, but it was seriously misinterpreted as me and K123 berating a guide like we aren't grateful for others efforts.
By Sylph.Brahmsz 2024-04-29 06:50:02
Greetings y'all,
This conversation again eh? Yeah, this pops up every 4-6 months or so. As Proth has mentioned, if folx feel that that know better and can do a better job, it is a Community Guide and it is free to edit.
As mentioned about the disclaimer, it is meant to help New & Returning players out, and as I've done with multiple other Community Job Guides, have tried diligently to craft tiers of sets that are accessible and reasonable to build up/through.
Sure, someone could just be shortcutted to Nyame & Sakpata, but that isn't always the case and (in my humble opinion) isn't the responsible thing to tell people to do...
On a side note to Kylos, the "Don't be a R15 Calal/R0 Sakpata DRK" line is a bit of an inside joke. I apologize about that one, but... my personal experience of the last 3+ years now have been of DRK's that dump a bunch of detritus into their Caladbolg but run around in R0 Sakpata and complain about their damage being bad...
Anywho.. I've made several edits in the past and honestly, I'm content with where it's at and what I was able to do in there. And in more than one place I've mentioned that people can just visit the High-End Sets Guide here. Again, others can edit it if they feel they know better or do a better job.
Have a good one y'all.
Kthxbai.
By K123 2024-04-29 08:48:14
While I appreciate your effort, leaving Valorous body in as bis TP piece is inexcusable. Nothing against just you, nearly all the guides are half-updated and half left outdated which in turn doesn't really help anyone much.
Attack not capped, does Epam beat Niqmaddu for Torc on average?
By Nariont 2024-04-29 09:15:26
Maybe im missing something but valor body as a purely offensive TP building piece is slightly better than sak body provided you get some good rolls, its either 7 DA and 3 STP or 10 STP and 2 DA with 40~45 acc, there's also DM rolls but good luck there.
Would i suggest it over sakpata? Not really but its not much diff from af legs vs sakpata legs, with AF being slightly better for TP gain but losing all of the defensive benefit
By K123 2024-04-29 11:20:31
I suppose "guides" like this make no actual sense without reference to specific content.
The only way they would be useful would be if there were TP and WS sets classified for Sheol C, V20 NMs, V25NMs, and Sortie.
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By Bahamut.Celebrindal 2024-04-29 11:35:30
Maybe im missing something but valor body as a purely offensive TP building piece is slightly better than sak body provided you get some good rolls, its either 7 DA and 3 STP or 10 STP and 2 DA with 40~45 acc, there's also DM rolls but good luck there.
Would i suggest it over sakpata? Not really but its not much diff from af legs vs sakpata legs, with AF being slightly better for TP gain but losing all of the defensive benefit
Consider several things, without even opening the discussion about the defensive benefits of a Sak body over even the greatest augment Valorous body, which you acknowledged early:
The Vast majority of DRKs will be using a weapon with some form of TP phase aftermath that increases damage per swing: Apoc, Caladbolg, Redemption, Origin, or Helheim. As such, the +5% crit rate and ~35 more melee +attack on the Sakpata starts to matter a lot more. Considering that in proper buff situations you're gonna 99k WSs all day long, what happens in between the weapon skills is starting to matter a helluva lot more, not just getting to it as fast as possible and ignoring the strength of what happens during that time.
 Carbuncle.Maletaru
Server: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2697
By Carbuncle.Maletaru 2024-04-29 11:38:48
A guide should be targeted to a specific audience, which this one seems to be, and explain what it is and isn't.
Ultimately just comes down to the complexity of gearing in FFXI; there are loads of situations you face and they're not all equal and you need to adjust gear appropriately for those situations (subjobs or no, duration of fights, single-wielding, dual-wielding, or using 2h weapon, meva needs, DT needs, Mythic weapon or not, level of buff support, which buffs, etc. etc.)
Tack on to that the levels of access to gear that a player could have and you can end up with 50 different TP sets in a single guide, which is just confusing, especially for a new player.
I think a simple guide to get you off the ground is a good thing and having more advanced guides for when you get more gear later is also nice. Ultimately though, people will need to make their own decisions about what they should use in a given situation, both because it can vary depending on your group and it's difficult to prescribe a one size fits all answer, but also because it helps that person to grow as a player to be able to understand the mechanics of the game, their job, and the buffs they're getting and really make good decisions.
The game's too nuanced for someone else to do all the work for you. At some point you have to decide "this situation is too dangerous to go into a glass cannon drain potency set, I'm going to die" or figure out exactly how much Ratri you can wear to get a good Scarlet Delirium up without dying, and various other things. Nobody will be there to hold your hand and tell you that you can adjust your haste needs for when LR is up, or that with 3 SV Minuets, CC chaos, and Bolster Fury you should be wearing PDL. You need to figure these things out on your own, there are too many permutations to put into a guide (IMO).
DRK TP set (Beginner, scythe, no AM3, low attack, high accuracy, low meva, high dt, LR up, SAM sub, no sam roll)
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By K123 2024-04-29 11:57:55
Ok, let's change the subject. I see on wiki someone claims they just Torc'd Kalunga V25 to death with no mention of making SC. Is this really a viable strat? Just try and melee burn it and not plan for breaking aura etc?
Cerberus.Kylos
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4475
By Cerberus.Kylos 2024-04-29 12:01:44
Greetings y'all,
This conversation again eh? Yeah, this pops up every 4-6 months or so. As Proth has mentioned, if folx feel that that know better and can do a better job, it is a Community Guide and it is free to edit.
As mentioned about the disclaimer, it is meant to help New & Returning players out, and as I've done with multiple other Community Job Guides, have tried diligently to craft tiers of sets that are accessible and reasonable to build up/through.
Sure, someone could just be shortcutted to Nyame & Sakpata, but that isn't always the case and (in my humble opinion) isn't the responsible thing to tell people to do...
On a side note to Kylos, the "Don't be a R15 Calal/R0 Sakpata DRK" line is a bit of an inside joke. I apologize about that one, but... my personal experience of the last 3+ years now have been of DRK's that dump a bunch of detritus into their Caladbolg but run around in R0 Sakpata and complain about their damage being bad...
Anywho.. I've made several edits in the past and honestly, I'm content with where it's at and what I was able to do in there. And in more than one place I've mentioned that people can just visit the High-End Sets Guide here. Again, others can edit it if they feel they know better or do a better job.
Have a good one y'all.
Kthxbai.
Hi Braams. I wasn't sure if this was the same guy who made the guide that ran with my LS years ago. Sorry if I was snarky man. I get the sakpata comment now, because I know players who just R15 a weapon and full time V0 Ody gear for everything without ever changing sets. It just didn't click because I was very tired.
I appreciate everyone who contributes to helping new DRKs. You know me, that has always been my thing. I should have read the guide instead of skimming through and making a dumb comment. I'll take a better look at it later today. Cheers.
 Bahamut.Mhysa
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 136
By Bahamut.Mhysa 2024-04-29 13:39:19
Ok, let's change the subject. I see on wiki someone claims they just Torc'd Kalunga V25 to death with no mention of making SC. Is this really a viable strat? Just try and melee burn it and not plan for breaking aura etc?
You mentioned your gear is the best on the comments above. So you go test it out and come back to tell us.
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By Bahamut.Justthetip 2024-04-29 13:40:28
Bahamut.Justthetip said: »I have it also but think I will stick to Brutal/Telos and Crep/Telos if I need more acc. This is what I was using already but checked this earlier:
https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Community_Dark_Knight_Guide
tbh the whole thing is complete nonsense, how is this the community guide? Suggests Valorous body for TP, DRK earring, etc. I mean some of that is just based on stuff you have and the ***isn't end all be all. If you know it's nonsense just make your owe set and stop using guides? Like why complain about guides if you don't know how to play the job yourself or ask for info on something if you just gonna ignore it anyway seems like a waste of time.
Well... this guide opens with "Please don't be a R15 Calad / R0 Sakpata DRK..."
So the gear you guys are saying the gear hss no plsce in 2024 it hss no place for you guys but thatd not for everyone. Most of the people on this forun run damage spread sheets and ***but most cant play the job. Damn near all the spreadsheets on here don't factor in none perfect setups. Or mob type its just oh this is perfect best dps. Like last post said if you cant understand a guide and how to take pieces from it then i dont want dps numbers from you or hate if you cant understand gearing in a 20 year old game(not for you but for people who ***on guides and blah blah)
I have been exactly this for about two years now, and only because I have focused more so on Sortie and other content than Odyssey (I also took a year break). It baffles me how being a R15 Calad / R0 Sakpata DRK is a bad thing.
I had a look at the guide, and while I admire how plentiful they are, some of the sets are puzzling. You're right about random Geas Fete equipment which has no place in 2024, especially if a player has a full set of R0 Sakpata. It is old gear severely lacking in defensive stats. I've had a better time making my own sets from the damage calculator, and it feels like I should share some of those soon.
WAY too many "guides" show you what the best sets are assuming you have Nyame/Sakpata maxed, which is absolutely ridiculous for anyone looking for a guide. Nobody with gear this maxed should be needing help from anyone else (although a few might). Would anyone be interested in my sets from the damage calculator? I'd only take the time to share if there is decent interest for DRK sets.
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By Bahamut.Justthetip 2024-04-29 13:42:45
I suppose "guides" like this make no actual sense without reference to specific content.
The only way they would be useful would be if there were TP and WS sets classified for Sheol C, V20 NMs, V25NMs, and Sortie. Or if you understood how to play the job at all and not think trust buffs are maxing you out on stats..
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By K123 2024-04-29 14:23:19
Ok, let's change the subject. I see on wiki someone claims they just Torc'd Kalunga V25 to death with no mention of making SC. Is this really a viable strat? Just try and melee burn it and not plan for breaking aura etc?
You mentioned your gear is the best on the comments above. So you go test it out and come back to tell us. I mentioned it was the best for the context I was asking about. Not sure why you're so pissy, but I struggle to see how this is a recommendable strat. I think it is possible but would it be more reliable than other strats?
By K123 2024-04-29 14:24:53
Bahamut.Justthetip said: »I suppose "guides" like this make no actual sense without reference to specific content.
The only way they would be useful would be if there were TP and WS sets classified for Sheol C, V20 NMs, V25NMs, and Sortie. Or if you understood how to play the job at all and not think trust buffs are maxing you out on stats.. Noone has said that and I've literally written the opposite and suggested epam or niqmaddu for this reason. Keep trying though.
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By Asura.Aquatiq 2024-04-29 14:32:58
are we even looking at the same thing? because my browser scroll bar is like 10 pixels tall due to the number of TP sets listed WITH BIG CAN'T-MISS BANNERS for different scenarios ( r0/r20/r30) and content
https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Community_Dark_Knight_Guide#TP_Sets
the valorous body mentions aren't even controversial because of the set as a whole & total gear haste. it's almost like if you don't want to use valorous you can use a set with Sakpata in it and compensate with some other swaps, which the guide has
but sure, "guide is junk" because of one item
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By K123 2024-04-29 14:56:43
I didn't say one item. The reading comprehension is so bad here. I also raised jse earring not being bis for TP just to give another example of what has already been explicitly stated.
 Fenrir.Velner
Server: Fenrir
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Posts: 429
By Fenrir.Velner 2024-04-29 15:58:21
Ok, let's change the subject. I see on wiki someone claims they just Torc'd Kalunga V25 to death with no mention of making SC. Is this really a viable strat? Just try and melee burn it and not plan for breaking aura etc?
It's definitely possible, if not preferable, to crank Kalunga without breaking his Aura. It prevents the use of Lahar which makes the fight soooo much less annoying.
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By K123 2024-04-29 16:08:47
Doesn't light heal it though? In which case you can't just spam torc anyway for risk of healing it?
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By Fenrir.Richybear 2024-04-29 16:32:22
Now you gotta hear me out on this. Forget Sakpata whether it's augmented or not. Look at this set bonus. LOOK. AT IT.
ItemSet 395531
PDT -10% to go with looking sweet.
Augment yourself a MacBain and go to Dollarama with your Balarama Grip.
Speaking of Macbain, upon closer inspection, Dollarama is a Canada only thing.
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Valefor.Philemon
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By Valefor.Philemon 2024-04-29 17:53:29
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Fenrir.Velner
Server: Fenrir
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Posts: 429
By Fenrir.Velner 2024-04-29 17:55:57
Doesn't light heal it though? In which case you can't just spam torc anyway for risk of healing it?
Just spamming Torc and doing lights would be a problem as would the WS wall, but the concept of just cranking through the Aura is fine. It's great, even! If I recall correctly when we tried this out, we did RUN WAR BLU BRD COR WHM and it was dead with 7+ mins still on the clock.
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