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Gay rights abroad
 Fenrir.JinjoVIP
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2269
By Fenrir.Jinjo 2012-08-05 19:11:57
Feel free to point out to me where I said that, then. My only argument was that you are unable to fully know what it's like to be oppressed as LGBTQ if you are not LGBTQ. I've never suggested that it means anything.
It's not a bad thing or shortcoming that you aren't able to, it just is.
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 16303
By Ramuh.Sagittario 2012-08-05 19:12:07
What I have said is that if a LGBTQ individual is going to tell you about their experience as an LGBTQ individual, you should, if interested, listen.
Yes but instead of telling us anything you have already stated several times that none of us understand because we are not gay and continue to use your sexuality to shield you from having to explain your arguments.
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 5381
By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2012-08-05 19:13:10
Quetzalcoatl.Xueye said: »ITT we backpedal and rewrite history.
You can't rewrite history, particularly when you live in a country that fails/refuses to recognize the history of your community to begin with.
[+]
Quetzalcoatl.Xueye
Server: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6386
By Quetzalcoatl.Xueye 2012-08-05 19:13:24
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »Quetzalcoatl.Xueye said: »ITT we backpedal and rewrite history.
You can't rewrite history, particularly when you live in a country that fails/refuses to recognize the history of your community to begin with. Talking about in the topic.
Fenrir.Jinjo
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By Fenrir.Jinjo 2012-08-05 19:13:44
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »Quetzalcoatl.Xueye said: »ITT we backpedal and rewrite history.
You can't rewrite history, particularly when you live in a country that fails/refuses to recognize the history of your community to begin with.
Sure you can, have you ever read a history textbook? Guaranteed it's not what happened. :P
Fenrir.Sylow
Server: Fenrir
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Posts: 6862
By Fenrir.Sylow 2012-08-05 19:14:32
Server: Bahamut
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By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2012-08-05 19:14:58
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »Quetzalcoatl.Xueye said: »ITT we backpedal and rewrite history.
You can't rewrite history, particularly when you live in a country that fails/refuses to recognize the history of your community to begin with. Sure you can, have you ever read a history textbook? Guaranteed it's not what happened. :P 
I <3 my HS history teacher for using this instead of the standard curriculum! A bit off topic lol
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Posts: 33979
By Bismarck.Dracondria 2012-08-05 19:15:34
Nuuu Swedish music
Edit: Nvm was just a mix >_>
Server: Ramuh
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Posts: 16303
By Ramuh.Sagittario 2012-08-05 19:17:42
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »I understood that. There is always a chance an impressionable person (in this case, me learning from you, specifically, about the numerous rights the LGBT community is trying to secure) would believe it.
If you want an impression of the LGBT community. Don't judge them by individuals online. Make genuine real-life friendships. There is often a lot of misinterpretation online.
These forums, especially, often develop into hostile pissing contests. Much has to do with different age groups, education, upbringings, etc...
There are all different types of LGBT- just like there are all different types of straight people.
EXACTLY! This is what puzzles me the most, I have plenty of gay friends and I treat them no differently from anyone else, which is exactly what the gay community are campaigning for in the first place; to be treated equally as everyone else.
I see Min and Sylow telling us that their arguments do not represent the LGBT community, yet the arguments that they don't like from non LGBT members somehow represent the entire population.
I see posts from them telling me I should sympathise and treat them as victims, recognise them as being different and that I should recognise my gay friends as being different. You implied that asking not be discriminated against in the workplace for being gay was special treatment. Don't feign confusion over why people somehow took that the wrong way.
Absolutely not, I have no idea where you got that from, I never mentioned anywhere that people should have to ask not to be discriminated against in the workplace, I highlighted the hypocrisy in the situation by highlighting the way that a LGBT member is all too willing to use their status as a claim of discrimination against an employer. It's not an opinion, it's not made up, these are real life cases that happen and are often in the mainstream media.
If you can highlight where in my OP I stated that not asking to be discriminated against was special treatment, please show me.
It's interesting to observe the level of equality and the level of animosity towards gay rights in different countries. Over here in the UK an employer would not dare fire a gay employee over a minor offense or make them redundant because they could find themselves taken to court accused of discrimination, unless of course it was an out right breach of contract. A non gay employee however could not use their sexuality to make such a claim, it's this kind of thing that contributes largely to the animosity that gay people feel from society because gay members of society want to be treated as equal, yet these kind of cases allow them to be granted special treatment over others, in turn making it look like they are more deserved or entitled than others.
 Cerberus.Eugene
Server: Cerberus
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Posts: 6999
By Cerberus.Eugene 2012-08-05 19:18:02
[+]
Fenrir.Jinjo
VIP
Server: Fenrir
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Posts: 2269
By Fenrir.Jinjo 2012-08-05 19:19:53
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 5381
By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2012-08-05 19:20:47
Fenrir.Sylow
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6862
By Fenrir.Sylow 2012-08-05 19:21:49
Seriously I'm DJing a party tonight and
They didn't tell me, so I'm having to build a setlist from scratch since I'm on my new computer with no music.
Suggestions?
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15065
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2012-08-05 19:22:02
[+]
Cerberus.Pleebo
Server: Cerberus
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Posts: 9720
By Cerberus.Pleebo 2012-08-05 19:22:16
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »I understood that. There is always a chance an impressionable person (in this case, me learning from you, specifically, about the numerous rights the LGBT community is trying to secure) would believe it.
If you want an impression of the LGBT community. Don't judge them by individuals online. Make genuine real-life friendships. There is often a lot of misinterpretation online.
These forums, especially, often develop into hostile pissing contests. Much has to do with different age groups, education, upbringings, etc...
There are all different types of LGBT- just like there are all different types of straight people.
EXACTLY! This is what puzzles me the most, I have plenty of gay friends and I treat them no differently from anyone else, which is exactly what the gay community are campaigning for in the first place; to be treated equally as everyone else.
I see Min and Sylow telling us that their arguments do not represent the LGBT community, yet the arguments that they don't like from non LGBT members somehow represent the entire population.
I see posts from them telling me I should sympathise and treat them as victims, recognise them as being different and that I should recognise my gay friends as being different. You implied that asking not be discriminated against in the workplace for being gay was special treatment. Don't feign confusion over why people somehow took that the wrong way.
Absolutely not, I have no idea where you got that from, I never mentioned anywhere that people should have to ask not to be discriminated against in the workplace, I highlighted the hypocrisy in the situation by highlighting the way that a LGBT member is all too willing to use their status as a claim of discrimination against an employer. It's not an opinion, it's not made up, these are real life cases that happen and are often in the mainstream media.
If you can highlight where in my OP I stated that not asking to be discriminated against was special treatment, please show me.
It's interesting to observe the level of equality and the level of animosity towards gay rights in different countries. Over here in the UK an employer would not dare fire a gay employee over a minor offense or make them redundant because they could find themselves taken to court accused of discrimination, unless of course it was an out right breach of contract. A non gay employee however could not use their sexuality to make such a claim, it's this kind of thing that contributes largely to the animosity that gay people feel from society because gay members of society want to be treated as equal, yet these kind of cases allow them to be granted special treatment over others, in turn making it look like they are more deserved or entitled than others. Misread it then. Sorry-oes
Fenrir.Jinjo
VIP
Server: Fenrir
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Posts: 2269
By Fenrir.Jinjo 2012-08-05 19:23:45
Sabrina, the Teenage Witch was a really cool TV show.
That's RuPaul, for reference.
Fenrir.Jinjo
VIP
Server: Fenrir
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Posts: 2269
By Fenrir.Jinjo 2012-08-05 19:25:57
Seriously I'm DJing a party tonight and
They didn't tell me, so I'm having to build a setlist from scratch since I'm on my new computer with no music.
Suggestions?
Birthday Cake. Three different versions.
Cerberus.Eugene
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6999
By Cerberus.Eugene 2012-08-05 19:26:09
too bad snoop lion will never get around to doing anything like this..
Fenrir.Sylow
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6862
By Fenrir.Sylow 2012-08-05 19:26:16
I'm making red velvet cake martinis.
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 16303
By Ramuh.Sagittario 2012-08-05 19:27:34
I guess now the lol card is being played I should find an amusing picture.
Fenrir.Schutz
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3122
By Fenrir.Schutz 2012-08-05 19:29:28
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »I understood that. There is always a chance an impressionable person (in this case, me learning from you, specifically, about the numerous rights the LGBT community is trying to secure) would believe it.
If you want an impression of the LGBT community. Don't judge them by individuals online. Make genuine real-life friendships. There is often a lot of misinterpretation online.
These forums, especially, often develop into hostile pissing contests. Much has to do with different age groups, education, upbringings, etc...
There are all different types of LGBT- just like there are all different types of straight people.
EXACTLY! This is what puzzles me the most, I have plenty of gay friends and I treat them no differently from anyone else, which is exactly what the gay community are campaigning for in the first place; to be treated equally as everyone else.
I see Min and Sylow telling us that their arguments do not represent the LGBT community, yet the arguments that they don't like from non LGBT members somehow represent the entire population.
I see posts from them telling me I should sympathise and treat them as victims, recognise them as being different and that I should recognise my gay friends as being different. You implied that asking not be discriminated against in the workplace for being gay was special treatment. Don't feign confusion over why people somehow took that the wrong way.
Absolutely not, I have no idea where you got that from, I never mentioned anywhere that people should have to ask not to be discriminated against in the workplace, I highlighted the hypocrisy in the situation by highlighting the way that a LGBT member is all too willing to use their status as a claim of discrimination against an employer. It's not an opinion, it's not made up, these are real life cases that happen and are often in the mainstream media.
If you can highlight where in my OP I stated that not asking to be discriminated against was special treatment, please show me.
It's interesting to observe the level of equality and the level of animosity towards gay rights in different countries. Over here in the UK an employer would not dare fire a gay employee over a minor offense or make them redundant because they could find themselves taken to court accused of discrimination, unless of course it was an out right breach of contract. A non gay employee however could not use their sexuality to make such a claim, it's this kind of thing that contributes largely to the animosity that gay people feel from society because gay members of society want to be treated as equal, yet these kind of cases allow them to be granted special treatment over others, in turn making it look like they are more deserved or entitled than others.
Well part of the issue of what you brought up is that the term "protected group" (used by many Western countries, aka "protected class") arbitrarily covers certain groups...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protected_group
...and sexual identity isn't always a status to be protected in terms of discrimination (for housing/employment/etc.)
Cerberus.Eugene
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6999
By Cerberus.Eugene 2012-08-05 19:29:53
lol card? argument got boring.
[+]
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 16303
By Ramuh.Sagittario 2012-08-05 19:31:32
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »I understood that. There is always a chance an impressionable person (in this case, me learning from you, specifically, about the numerous rights the LGBT community is trying to secure) would believe it.
If you want an impression of the LGBT community. Don't judge them by individuals online. Make genuine real-life friendships. There is often a lot of misinterpretation online.
These forums, especially, often develop into hostile pissing contests. Much has to do with different age groups, education, upbringings, etc...
There are all different types of LGBT- just like there are all different types of straight people.
EXACTLY! This is what puzzles me the most, I have plenty of gay friends and I treat them no differently from anyone else, which is exactly what the gay community are campaigning for in the first place; to be treated equally as everyone else.
I see Min and Sylow telling us that their arguments do not represent the LGBT community, yet the arguments that they don't like from non LGBT members somehow represent the entire population.
I see posts from them telling me I should sympathise and treat them as victims, recognise them as being different and that I should recognise my gay friends as being different. You implied that asking not be discriminated against in the workplace for being gay was special treatment. Don't feign confusion over why people somehow took that the wrong way.
Absolutely not, I have no idea where you got that from, I never mentioned anywhere that people should have to ask not to be discriminated against in the workplace, I highlighted the hypocrisy in the situation by highlighting the way that a LGBT member is all too willing to use their status as a claim of discrimination against an employer. It's not an opinion, it's not made up, these are real life cases that happen and are often in the mainstream media.
If you can highlight where in my OP I stated that not asking to be discriminated against was special treatment, please show me.
It's interesting to observe the level of equality and the level of animosity towards gay rights in different countries. Over here in the UK an employer would not dare fire a gay employee over a minor offense or make them redundant because they could find themselves taken to court accused of discrimination, unless of course it was an out right breach of contract. A non gay employee however could not use their sexuality to make such a claim, it's this kind of thing that contributes largely to the animosity that gay people feel from society because gay members of society want to be treated as equal, yet these kind of cases allow them to be granted special treatment over others, in turn making it look like they are more deserved or entitled than others.
Well part of the issue of what you brought up is that the term "protected group" (used by many Western countries) arbitrarily covers certain groups...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protected_group
...and sexual identity isn't always a status to be protected in terms of discrimination (for housing/employment/etc.)
Yeh, I can see the misunderstanding, it was more an example of the leverage that comes with said groups.
Cerberus.Sevvy
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 769
By Cerberus.Sevvy 2012-08-05 19:35:22
Why must all gay threads turn into arguments? A Simple question was asked and evolved into this...
[+]
Fenrir.Jinjo
VIP
Server: Fenrir
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Posts: 2269
By Fenrir.Jinjo 2012-08-05 19:35:59
Bismarck.Josiahfk said: »meh overally pretty unimpressive and too 8-bit,unless that was the goal. But the bandwidth lowering for the middle 2 syllables of each "titanium" was appreciated lol
Music, varied tastes etc., etc. but I really enjoy a lot of their stuff. I don't care to be critical of technicalities when it comes to that kind of stuff, though. If it sounds/feels good to me, I listen.
Bismarck.Faelar
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4108
By Bismarck.Faelar 2012-08-05 20:59:53
By Jetackuu 2012-08-05 21:23:36
too bad snoop lion will never get around to doing anything like this..
reggae sucks is why...
 Shiva.Manini
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 55
By Shiva.Manini 2012-08-05 22:12:19
You'll have to forgive us American gays for being less friendly and obedient.
Most of us can still lose our jobs if our employers decide they don't like that we're gay.
And that's just the tip of the iceberg.
It's interesting to observe the level of equality and the level of animosity towards gay rights in different countries. Over here in the UK an employer would not dare fire a gay employee over a minor offense or make them redundant because they could find themselves taken to court accused of discrimination, unless of course it was an out right breach of contract. A non gay employee however could not use their sexuality to make such a claim, it's this kind of thing that contributes largely to the animosity that gay people feel from society because gay members of society want to be treated as equal, yet these kind of cases allow them to be granted special treatment over others, in turn making it look like they are more deserved or entitled than others.
Employers also have quotas to fill so we have to employ someone from this pool that is gay, even if they may be less qualified for a role. This is the same for other minorities, it's positive discrimination and one may argue it is a good thing but is it treating gay people equally? Personally I'd like to be chosen for my merits alone and not have a decision partly based on my sexuality like it is some sort of trick I can use. And honestly I don't feel why I should disclose it or why so many forms/applications ask for your sexuality ethnicity etc. If anything it puts me off because I fear some sort of discrimination be it positive or negative.
[+]
This isn't for the discussion of people's opinions on such a heated topic, just an honest question.
Since the ffxiah community has a pretty diverse community, was honestly just curious if gay rights was as big of an issue in England/Germany/Europe in general as it is over here in the states. Just seems like at least once a day there is something about it on national news somewhere over here, about the same across the Atlantic?
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