The Pirates' Lair: A Guide To Corsair

Shouldn't need to melee in VW at all ever

I know I shouldn't need too, but in fights such as qilin where I am wielding a dagger and using last stand anyway I was wondering if I could increase my ws rate and overall damage by meleeing.

Actually I do not think you are correct. If we assume that the boots give a single reroll on either a 1 or a 2, the distribution should look like this:

first second total
1 0.00 0.055555556 0.06
2 0.00 0.055555556 0.06
3 0.17 0.055555556 0.22
4 0.17 0.055555556 0.22
5 0.17 0.055555556 0.22
6 0.17 0.055555556 0.22
0.67 0.333333333 1.00

The first roll gives a 2/3 chance of 3-6 and there is a 1/3 chance of a reroll occuring. (1/3)*(1/6)=(1/18) gives us the chance for each number 1-6 occuring after the reroll. Add those to the chance of that number occuring before the reroll and you get 5.6% for a 1 or 2, and 22.2% for a 3-6.

edit: sorry if the table is hard to read, the spacing is not showing properly. I changed the wiki back as well.

I never melee on Qilin. Between wings/tact roll(i do fighter's/chaos for melee, then back up and tact. for myself)/atmacite I barely even have to shoot for TP and WS 10+ times per fight.

If you really need/want to though, that set looks ok (minus thaumas stuff)

Use Aluh or Nguul. Couldn't tell you which is better overall tbh but I'd be inclined to think Nguul would be better if ONLY using LS and not shooting/meleeing for TP.
Also switch out that suppa for something that will be useful. I would use STR earring but ghillie could work too

Why not mkris?

already going to have so much tp overflow anyway... i really dont even understand why you would want to melee in the first place. its just going to slow dps down. at least aluh/nguul boost LS dmg.

I see what happened, I was putting too much weight on the reroll section.
A more accurate version would be:
1 -> 1 2 3 4 5 6
2 -> 1 2 3 4 5 6
3 -> 3 3 3 3 3 3
4 -> 4 4 4 4 4 4
5 -> 5 5 5 5 5 5
6 -> 6 6 6 6 6 6

Which comes out to be:

#	--	Chances	--	%
1		2/36		5.5%
2		2/36		5.5%
3		8/36		22.2%
4		8/36		22.2%
5		8/36		22.2%
6		8/36		22.2%

That's what I get for trying to visualize something.

Left the supa in there just because I wasn't sure what to use for that slot, figured it was kinda useless /war, I'll pick up a ghillie. Thanks for the input.

I have attempted meleeing on my cor on a qilin run once, and I do agree that it is simply not worth it. You are likely to die and lose your 11 rolls and end up costing your DDs more DPS than you are adding.

However, if you are dead set on meleeing, you WILL do more damage if you are meleeing instead of just standing there waiting for regain. I don't understand the tp overflow argument in this case. You are getting more tp = you WS more often.

If my DD's aren't dying is there any reason I shouldn't be dying also?

I don't die on Melee cor......hell a thaumas cor is actually decent.

Other than bad luck on procs...I don't see why you would die actually.

I have a decent melee set I could use on COR but I'm never really "waiting on tp" lol and if I don't have a wing available, I'm WSing as soon as I hit 100tp. Otherwise, all it takes is 2 QD or a QD and regular shot and I can WS again. There's really no point.
I could stand at 5 yalms for max dmg (trueshot) and still get melee swings off, but for what, 100dmg? lol

Do whatever makes you happy tho, sure it won't make or break your groups

Stop spreading misleading information, gaining TP with Mkris with capped haste buff(march x2 or embrava) is faster than QD+RA. Unless you're lucky with triple shot proc/wing proc or rely on reset QD and the fight end before you run out of QDs. Which is very unreliable. If one shot missed the amount of time you spent on TP phrase also doubled. Chaos+tact also worked well on one hand melee TPing if acc isn't an issue. I also think it needs another TP set with STP instead of DA for melee ._.

While melee with Mkris is more reliable way to gain 100 TP fast. I did plenty of prov watcher runs with plenty of parse data, compare with myself and other COR using /ra+QD+wings, pretty sure I got more WS fired off on average with Mkris for watcher zergs.


However, on qilin it can be tricky, in order for Mkris to work well you need haste buff, which takes 2 song slots to do. You may also need at least 3~4k last stand dmg to make all the "squeeze out 1~2 more extra WS to do more dmg" worth while, and may need attack songs. It worked on prov watcher because ppl do BRD rotation on prov watcher and used SV, so you can get haste buff and still do 3~4k+ last stands.

But on qilin you may not have enough attack with 2 songs BRD if your ally doesn't have angon/dia3 up(most likely you won't have). You may(I'm not 100% sure though, haven't done qilin forever) ended up better off with 2 attack songs and /ra if you can't hit 3~4k avg.

I agree that it would not make a noticeable difference, hence why I normally do not melee in VW on cor. It is fun though.

Saves gil(bullets are over 100k/stack on my server) plus potentially more dmg is probably more than "it is fun" thing IMO.

Been playing with melee TP item set, just randomly tossing out ideas and not sure if it's good or not ._.





P.S: Epona's ring over tyrant seems close too.

If my math is done correctly, it seems to be fastest TP set with 7.3 TP/hit and 14 hit to 100 TP starting from 0. Mkris avg 1.9 times a round so that's about 7.7 sec to 100 TP with 0 regain. Embrava+tact+monarch+atmacite= 14 TP tick avg, you can hit 100 TP in maybe 6 sec starting from 0 without using QD.

As for Aluh v.s Mkris, it seems that Aluh DPS isn't very high on prov watcher due to being 1h weapon. Try to use more ranged WS should be better. I'm not sure about qilin though.


As for argument of "slow dps down"

Gun=5.2 sec with 0 snapshot, maybe(based on stopwatch eyeball, my video recorder lags if I use it and I can't get precise time on /ra speed)takes about 4.2~4.5 sec if you play perfect to shoot 1 bullet, with 0 regain it takes maybe 18~20 sec to hit 100 TP starting from 0. Assuming 20 TP/hit, with 14 TP tick regain it's 13.5 sec to 100 TP if you play perfect with /ra speed(most likely you don't due to lag anyways) If QD up you can hit 100 TP in 10 sec with 2 /ra 1 QD. But it's not always up and even if it's up it still slower than Mkris.

So in 60 sec, MKris can WS about 9~10 times without worrying about QD up or not. And /ra + QD you WS about 6 times. (In reality you usually do less WS due to lag/human error though)

LS is a 3~4k+ WS(this setup isn't worth using if you can't hit that high), /ra dmg is usually about 350~390 a shot on PW if I remember correctly. Let's say 400 dmg a hit, you need to hit 10 times to make up the dmg of extra 1 last stand. And it's unlikely you can shoot 10 times in 18 sec. You pretty much have to rely on chain proc for wings to catch up, and good luck on perfect timing of procs. Takes 3 sec to use wings too, the time you use wings Mkris already over half way to 100 TP.

Unless my math is way off somewhere(it may be, idk!) I see mkris parse higher than /ra+QD as long as you can hit 3k~4k+ last stand. You can probably get better last stand numbers and do 150~200 more dmg if you /ra in right spot, but it's not worth sacrificing the amount of last stand you can do IMO.

Edit: "Not making a noticeable/game changing difference should never become a supporting argument regarding how to improve job performance. 99% of game play style/gear set discussion doesn't make more than 5% difference and never make or break, we may as well don't try to research about optimal setup since nothing is make or break. Obviously you can kill every NM even if COR naked."

And with the Dusty Wings argument, I remember hearing somewhere before that using wings slows down your weaponskill frequency due to item delay.

In the case of /ra, you pretty much have to use it though, especially for none 3rd pt tool users, /ra is just that slow ._.

Indeed.

I've seen a Corsair using Mercurial Kris and a handy melee build gain 100 TP in the time it's taken me to use a Dusty Wing. We had double march and haste and his accuracy parsed at 93%. I was not meleeing but it took me longer to get 100 TP than him.

For weapon skill frequency he utterly destroyed me, though my Last Stands were dealing marginally more damage. Overall, however, he came far ahead in the parse. This was on Qilin, by the way.

I really don't understand this "TP Overflow" argument. What is your point, even? If you have surplus TP, weapon skill more often and do more damage.

For a fair comparison you needed to have minuets though, not to mention gear difference, possibly food.

I'm confident on Qilin I'd parse always higher shooting with a good LS weapon and minuets rather than meleeing with marches.

P-Watcher is different and Afania explained why.

We had two minuets two. I mentioned the march only to illustrate he was gaining TP fast.

But really where the hell do you people find groups that actually let you do 3 rolls? I often have to beg to at least let me do 2 before the fight. 80% of the time I have to make them half-way also...doing tactician is a waste of time for me most of the times. So normally I only have chaos/fighters on.

I didn't say anything about three rolls.

For last stand would the two earrings match up for decent damage? For a cheaper r/ex way at least. Wilhelm's Earring annnnnnnddddd the other one? lol iirc it gives 8 AGI + Ranged Acc/Attk

I didn't say Aeyela. People above mentioned tact roll.

If you don't have moonshade, they're best in slot.

Aside from melee beating shooting on spreadsheet, parse, and napkin logic.. no player is shooting the instant shot is available either. If Seha alt-tabs to watch porn while ranged COR, she's getting no damage. My COR mule on the other hand, is acquiring TP through melee.

Shooting is for people who are afraid of AOEs and people who don't buff properly.

Define 'buff properly'. I see no reason to be buffing if my party has x2 11s. Besides, Luzaf's Ring says Hey.

It was referring to the quantity/location of BRDs within the alliance, not rolling methodology.