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Ballista Tournament
Ramuh.Austar
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10464
By Ramuh.Austar 2011-11-08 01:05:11
Valefor.Prothescar said: » Starcraft II and saying "YOU DUN PLAY CAMPUGN 9 HOURS A DAY YOU ARE THE FAIL LOLZ" My torrent, I can do what I want.
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Phoenix.Shiomi
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 654
By Phoenix.Shiomi 2011-11-08 01:15:45
Valefor.Prothescar said: »I win. Goodnight
The fact that you think discussions can have winners is pretty silly. Your personally opinion is flawed in that you think people who don't PVP are good at this game, then you are wrong. People who only play PvE are good at getting ***... but in the end everyone can get the same old ***. When it comes down to it, beating someone in PvP even with a job that isn't "tier 1" is 100x more satisfying and viewed by others as actually accomplishing something. You got an Apocalypse? Woopdyfreakingdo. So does 100 other people. But taking a DRK, a decent but deferentially not the best PvP job, and beating a RDM one of the best PvP jobs in the game, is note worthy. Why? Because not everyone can do it, and he has proven that using unique job combos with unique gear breaks down these barriers of "No one can beat a RDM." because, simply put... you can.
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Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4
By Bahamut.Exaurious 2011-11-08 01:35:28
RDM FTW, woot woot XD
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 525
By Asura.Leonlionheart 2011-11-08 01:56:28
I have a hard time believing anyone thinks that if you don't PvP you suck at FFXI.
Now if you say, "You don't PvP, you suck at PvP in FFXI," I could understand. Even, "You don't PvE, you suck at PvE in FFXI." But 98% of this game only PvE's, so PvP is pretty irrelevant except for a fun challenge.
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Phoenix.Shiomi
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 654
By Phoenix.Shiomi 2011-11-08 02:27:41
I just have a problem with people saying, "I'm the best PLD in the game." and then you say, "Oh wanna PVP?" And they say no... they aren't the best PLD. The pld with no relic/emp who actually accepts the challenge is better. That other person just doesn't want to risk losing face.
Leviathan.Draylo
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
By Leviathan.Draylo 2011-11-08 02:32:31
I just have a problem with people saying, "I'm the best PLD in the game." and then you say, "Oh wanna PVP?" And they say no... they aren't the best PLD. The pld with no relic/emp who actually accepts the challenge is better. That other person just doesn't want to risk losing face.
PVP isn't important sorry, and I would never judge a PLD based on whether or not they could PVP... This whole game is PVE based, that is a fact. I would love for SE to add some updates and balance PVP, and it would actually enhance the length of this games life imo, but it won't happen or hasn't yet.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 525
By Asura.Leonlionheart 2011-11-08 02:43:09
Pretty sure the reason people play this game is to develop there character to it's peak, or for story line. Neither of which have much to do with PvP.
So as you may not be the best PLD at PvP, you can still pretty easily say you're the best PLD in the game for what the game is.
By anjisnu 2011-11-08 03:05:28
lol ive never won a PvP match stupid gear swap penalties i always forget lol
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 03:35:11
Asura.Leonlionheart said: »Pretty sure the reason people play this game is to develop there character to it's peak, or for story line. Neither of which have much to do with PvP.
So as you may not be the best PLD at PvP, you can still pretty easily say you're the best PLD in the game for what the game is.
In reality, its the people who want to be awesome but simply discredit a system to hide how terrible they are, you're like the people who say Haste isn't godly and WHM's who cure in Relic pants.
The problem is when people who don't PvP comment on it and live vicariously through snarky comments and act as if they know what they are talking about. If a person never PvP'd never talked about it and truly didn't care, never gave anyone ***about, then there is no problem.
The entirety of the game, which is PvP and PvE. Just because Draylo is a too weak Blue Mage, who posts in my threads about PvP with stupid comments like 0/10. Then whenever its brought up skulks into the corner.
Because the Paladin doesn't know that Diaga wipes shadows or that he has to do things besides auto afk burtgang/Aegis tank, seems to be his own problem.
Can't be at your peak when you're losing to full perle, pink blu's and NINs! What kind of a peak is that, bottom of the barrel?
You should want to be the best at both.
And storyline, PvP does have a story if you want to get technical, and its place in the universe. In fact the storyline consisted of all three nations murdering each other before WotG begins, and Excenmille the Ballista quest NPC is a main character in the WotG Sandy story line. Derp.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 525
By Asura.Leonlionheart 2011-11-08 03:41:23
Well it's not like you're going to change your mind.
Probably just trying to get people to /nerdrage and come out and try PvP, even though they probably are the best at PvE.
Either way, it's really stupid to think anyone is a bad player based on PvP outcomes.
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 03:43:18
Asura.Leonlionheart said: »Well it's not like you're going to change your mind.
Probably just trying to get people to /nerdrage and come out and try PvP, even though they probably are the best at PvE.
Either way, it's really stupid to think anyone is a bad player based on PvP outcomes.
I also think players are bad when they WS for ***, use stupid Atmas, and spam Cure IV instead of VI.
I also think they are crap if they don't gear swap, don't try to cap haste during TP, and if they aren't using or working on Magian staves as BLM/SCH/Whatever.
However I will concede to you, they are not a bad player.
They are simply weak, and are limiting themselves.
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Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-11-08 03:57:03
PVE and PVP are not connected. I know people who are good at PVE and absolutely suck at PVP. I know people who are good at PVP, would love them on my team every match, but wouldn't even bother taking them on a salvage run (at lv 95)
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 04:04:30
As a Dark Knight I want to be perfect in PvP and PvE and have consummate mastery in both things, that's what I strive to do. It is about pushing your job to the max of its ability, collecting every item in the game is asinine.
The main issue is people mixing the spheres themselves, sitting on Jeuno acting the fool. When you could cut through their Aegis like butter.
The truth of the matter is you know people who act like they are something special and would get downed easily and by people with 1/10th of what they possess. Usually these people are ***-talkers and you know who you are and who they are, and they are the source of the problem. This is the true problem.
Anyone who is good or respectable at PvP can't bash PvE because that's how you get the gear to do your event,so these people are equally worthless.
The problem goes both ways, and anyone who can't handle an lolsalvage run can't PvP, I'd brutalize them.
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-11-08 04:09:44
Quote: The problem goes both ways, and anyone who can't handle an lolsalvage run can't PvP, I'd brutalize them.
Not true at all, again, as I said, I know a good number of players who I'd take on my team in ballista every time, but would never come close to inviting them for anything involving PVE
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 04:11:01
So they are going to PvP in their crap gear, because they can't handle events that require less coordination, skill, and are repetitive?
How are they possibly going to compete with somebody like me, what are they running around in starter gear and Bronze Axes?
PvE is entirely necessary, if you can't do that simple task effectively then its hopeless.
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-11-08 04:13:17
You as well as I both know you don't gear the same for PVE as you do PVP. They may have some great ballista sets, but may tp in askar and denali when it comes to pve stuff, have bad ws gear, etc.
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 04:14:23
So I'm supposed to be worried about a person who can't figure out a WS set?
Or would be too lazy to procure the necessary niche/end game items to defeat me in certain situations?
I use a lot of the same gear I do in PvP that I do in PvE:
AF2, A lot of my PDT set, Twilight, Bale, Grim + 1 (I'm sure Meikogai would be Amazing) End Game stuff is good stuff.
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-11-08 04:14:55
Quote: PvE is entirely necessary, if you can't do that simple task effectively then its hopeless.
I'm not saying these ppl can't do these things. I'm saying I'd never invite them.
Turban vs Denali was never going to be a gamebreaking change or determine whether or not you win or lose at something (for example, if I took my old 75 set, replaced turban w/ denali, it wouldn't make me lose at everything I succeeded at), but just the fact that they wear denali over turban, I'd have considered them a sucky player.
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 04:17:31
In the end mastering both will only improve you, its not a flawed system, there are ways around it, people are lazy and People want to be flawed because that is easy for them. Nothing is totally perfect but it is much more stable than it is given credit for.
Its not that I have a problem with PvE, I have a problem with PvE players acting like they PvP, instead of knowing their place.
And PvP players acting like they are smart when they tell me to take out haste pieces for DA, that are lazy instead of knowing their place.
Can we agree that these are the cases I am trying to philosophically avoid, and when they do occur, and the above say either:
1) I don't gear swap cuz its stupid, Store TP is gay, and I want to Melee in STR gear.
2) PvP is dumb (even though I opened my fat mouth), you're all weak, I'm the best derp a derp - gonna sit in Jeuno now and talk about the time I used Divine Seal to do 2x holy damage derp.
To make fun of them.
But none of this will change me, I'll be looking forward to fighting Excalibur/Aegis, Tizona's and Ryunohige's wherever I can find them.
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-11-08 04:22:47
Quote: Its not that I have a problem with PvE, I have a problem with PvE players acting like they PvP, instead of knowing their place.
Which is why I'm implying they are two completely different worlds, where as you're implying that you if you're good at PVP, you're also good at PVE, which isn't necessarily true (and a lot of the times isn't).
Someone could buy a character w/ good gear and do absolutely nothing in the game, but ballista, and become fantastic at it.
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 04:23:52
I knew a guy who did that, and he was awful.
Not that it really discounts what you're saying - just a memory of mine.
If someone can manipulate their character into performing well in a team based event vs humans, they can easily do this versus the terrible AI that is FFXI PvE. Anywhere, everywhere, all the time.
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-11-08 04:30:50
Quote: If someone can manipulate their character into performing well in a team based event vs humans, they can easily do this versus the terrible AI that is FFXI PvE. Anywhere, everywhere, all the time.
But a lot of the time good strats won't work if people are undergeared. Again, you can have good pvp gear and not know how to gear for pve.
Take that person who was wearing denali over turban.
Now, he's rdm or blm.
He can stun on time, he can sleep the exact second its needed, but he doesn't have the acc gear to land it. I will consider that person shitty and not worth taking to anything, but I can take them to pvp and their excellent timing on sleeps and stuns can decide whether or not my team just won that match.
Take a good ballista whm, great w/ cures, great w/ buffs, great w/ -na spells, but take him out to pve and let's say they can't dig for elixirs and ethers all the time, have ***refresh gear, shitty cure% build, I'd take them in pvp again, but would not touch them w/ a 10 foot stick in pve
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 04:34:58
You don't seem to understand what I'm saying.
You can't have good PvP gear without good PvE gear because it overlaps more than you realize, aside from resistance pieces.
PvE gear is often good or the best PvP gear, Dark Rings, AF3+2, Empyreans, Magian Weapons, Voidwatch Bodies, Twilight Armor.
Especially with the advent of Abyssea.
I don't see how if they can't perform the easy task, they are going to be able to perform that hard one (PvP). They just sound lazy?
You need the tools to get the job done, skill-wise they are okay but it sounds like if they are this intelligent they'd easily remedy the one thing holding them back.
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-11-08 04:39:41
It doesn't overlap as much as you think. You can have great nuking gear, for example, and no mag acc gear and nuke the ***out of ppl in pvp and deal next to no damage in pve.
Players can't come close to the magic evasion of the mobs and NMs of PvE.
There are plenty of people w/ AF3+2 and emps who suck in PvE due to other things but can still do well in PvP.
Additionally, uncapped, while I find the most fun, isn't the end-all be all ballista. You can be shitty at lv 61+ PvE, including all endgame and still absolutely wreck ***in 60 cap
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 04:42:50
It doesn't overlap as much as you think. You can have great nuking gear, for example, and no mag acc gear and nuke the ***out of ppl in pvp and deal next to no damage in pve.
Players can't come close to the magic evasion of the mobs and NMs of PvE.
There are plenty of people w/ AF3+2 and emps who suck in PvE due to other things but can still do well in PvP.
Additionally, uncapped, while I find the most fun, isn't the end-all be all ballista. You can be shitty at lv 61+ PvE, including all endgame and still absolutely wreck ***in 60 cap
As far as nuking goes, empyrean pieces are the best with the set proc, the magic cast speed reduction, and the magic accuracy etc. Nothing really beats it. (Edit: Manawall enhancements)
Using resist traits, yes you can. You can become nearly immune to the ailment of your choice, resistance is powerful.
These people just sound lazy, and I fail to see how such incredibly intelligent and skilled players would be unable to form a three man group and attain much of what they need.
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-11-08 04:45:45
Good luck finding a team who is going to all dress up in resist gear for 1 mage on the other team.
You'll have your resist person, but in a team match, most of the time, when someone hits sleepga, para, gravity or something else, it's gonna land on their target.
6 on 6? Hit a sleepga, you're gonna hit someone on that team, regardless.
Have a sch do aoe paralyze, most of, if not all the targets are getting para'd, etc.
If you're talking 1 on 1, it's more gear intensive yes, but I don't even consider that ballista, that's diorama in my eyes, lol
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 04:47:20
Good luck finding a team who is going to all dress up in resist gear for 1 mage on the other team.
You'll have your resist person, but in a team match, most of the time, when someone hits sleepga, para, gravity or something else, it's gonna land on their target.
6 on 6? Hit a sleepga, you're gonna hit someone on that team, regardless.
Have a sch do aoe paralyze, most of, if not all the targets are getting para'd, etc.
If you're talking 1 on 1, it's more gear intensive yes, but I don't even consider that ballista, that's diorama in my eyes, lol
I prefer to build my skill and ability to kill any job with any gear on DRK, on my own merits, and not the indiscernible merits of a team that is conveniently vague.
Phoenix.Urteil
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-08 04:48:10
Double'd by mistake.
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-11-08 04:50:15
Okay, find a large match, where everyone on your team is always gonna have poison up, lol
EVENT OVER, TOURNAMENT 1 CHAMPION: JACKAVERTED
Stay tuned!
I am going to be hosting a 1 v 1 Ballista Tournament! Anyone is welcome to participate as the buy in will be 25,000, in addition to a 500,000g prize I will be furnishing myself.
The first place winner will also receive 50 x single pieces in a currency of their choice.
(Do not worry - as I will not be participating during the official proceedings and will be ineligible for the tournament prize.)
(However I will be up for battle, for anyone that wishes, after the event has finished.)
Anyone and everyone is welcome to join, the more people that turn out the better.
===============================================================
Where: Upper Jueno / Abdhaljs Isle-Purgonorgo
When: 11/5/2011 12:00PST|14:00CST|15:00EST|19:000GMT|
Why: The Champion will recieve 75% of the entry fee + 500,000g + Bronzpiece Or Whiteshell Or 1 Byne x 50!
(The remaining 25% will go to the runner ups.)
The champion will have the opportunity to face me in a special three round showdown after the tournament is concludedfor a chance at an even greater prize!
(Be sure to stop by if you have the conviction: http://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/26086/pvp-battlefield-judgement-and-comet-scrolls-do-you/)
You aren't wusses are you?! Well most of you are, but here's your chance!
Rules:
Any job combination of any level is allowed to join, I personally suggest a 95 one.
Two hours are prohibited.
There are no items allowed during matches, and food is prohibited.
You are not allowed to change your main job.
However you will be told the main job of your enemy, you must immediately declare a main and sub job in /tell and this cannot be changed.
Both participants will have no knowledge of their opponents sub job selection, only main job.
You will be given time to recover hp/mp between rounds.
Both participants will be in a party, with witnesses to see vitals and discourage shenanigans.
All bouts will consist of two rounds, the first person to two victories is the winner.
TP resets before and between rounds, both participants start each round with 0% TP.
Both participants in a match will begin at their camp, and have two minutes to cast enhancing magic / prepare for the encounter, meet on the beach and begin fighting. Kill on sight.
If you do not make it to the beach and are not actively pursuing your enemy in two minutes you will be disqualified.
All matches will be held on the beach on the north side of the map, kiting is allowed and encouraged for jobs that must make use of it.
Running close enough to the Posten so that your enemy cannot pursue you is an instant loss, and you will be disqualified.
All matches are process of elimination, the brackets and matchups will be decided when everyone is present.
If you do feel that you wish to come send me PM or /tell me in game and show up on the desired day.
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Anyone, and everyone, even if you have me blacklisted I will not refuse you. I can not stress enough how little I care about who you are etc.
Feel free to show up and kill each other for money! (And Glory.)
**Notes**
For pet jobs you can go to your Mog House and recover your pet between rounds.
Remember! Utility is golden.
Resist gear is never a bad idea, its a GREAT idea.
/Sprint is there for a reason
Gear swaps penalize you, so use your brain and make an advantageous gear set, unless you're retarded.
If you have /ANY/ questions about PvP or ballista feel free to talk to me, I will be glad to assist you with basic questions about gear swapping, differences to the battle system, etc.
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