Shadow Tanking?

1 Less shadow won't matter for any good PLD, and the amount of Enmity lost from a shadow is less than a hit taken (Depending on how much your hit for, since Enmity lost from being hit is based on your max HP and how much damage is dealt, but for any decent NM/HNM Shadows lose less Enmity by far).

That being said, I know /WAR has no place, any place /WAR could have for PLD, /BLU or /RDM (maybe RDM) Would be infinitely better. BLU Gets cocoon, which is Defender without the Attack loss, and RDM Gets access to Stoneskin (PLD has enough Enhancing Magic to cap it with a decent MND Build) and now self-refresh.

Basically /WAR is useless, except maybe for DD'ing, but hey, PLD/SAM is pretty hot in that department with a GS >.>; but i won't go there.

Also, above all else, maybe i'm insane D:, but i can't think of a single NM/HNM/Worthwhile Mob you would bring a BRD or Party too where a PLD/WAR with PDT could take 0's at any point... Maybe shield block with a RDM's maxed Phalanx/PhalanII and full -50% PDT in gear? with a Taco, hmmm.

Either way, I Think /NIN will stay the staple if you bring a PLD for quite a few fights, Not all of them, but i can't think of too many :|

But hey, not its "popular" to not bring PLDs and all he cool kid shells just use DD to tank, so yaaay.




That and Perfect Counter is hot for Shadows being down =o

Minne is NOT going to make a PLD take 0 dmg, please dont pull ***out of your *** before you post.

Now the new PDT Song on the other hand might be nice, I havent seen any testing for it tho, but on anything serious PLD is still going to take Damage...

Iunno PLD seems rather dead since abyssea came out, the Atonement gimp really hurt it bad in my opinion, that and other DD seem to tank the majority of NMs in abyssea just fine, MNK especially the job is just amazing.

Anyone have any good Returns screwing around with Sanguine since it was buffed up? I was screwing around with Vorpal blade, even with Atma buffs it still seems like crap :/

where we cant DD tank we do kite fights and a pld is useful there.. like the stupid konschat behemoth

1400 Sanguine off a mob from Prelude to a Storm, fully cured me when I was about to die on BLU.

Doing it on BLU is cheating <.<

You get MAB Trait, Memento Morri, not to mention alot easier to obtain MAB Gear, BLU can do some amazing damage with it there is no denying that, but were talking PLD here, PLD doesn't necessarily have MAB gear at the ready.

This would be the best possible MAB setup a PLD can have, the Majority of the items are not easy to obtain... PLD doesnt have it anywhere as easy as BLU to pump up the WS unfortunatley.

This guy has said everything I meant to say, With damage minus gear and absorb damage there is hardly a point to shadows, besides with new tough mobs with moves that are going to hit straight through your shadows or just kill them all in one move, what's the point? My other point is, what is the point in cheaply killing mobs like AV tanking as a dancer when SE showed us (with nearly 150 tries I heard) that it is possible to kill this mob normally, take the challenge and so don't be cheap. So Ninja main tanking is out I think, subbing sure on some mobs, in parties no but on some mobs sure sounds useful. And as far as the, "this is a late thread" comments, kick the foot out your butt and don't be jerks, I just started playing this game again after taking a three year break several months ago... I like the discussion keep posting :).

The whole point is that you lose a ***load more enmity Taking damage than you do losing 1 shadow.

Dont try to make false statements w/out doing the research, Kanican live journal do it up, if you care about enmity that's the place to research it and find out how it works.

Saying stuff like "you lose the same amount of enmity taking damage as you would losing a shadow!" is complete BS and your just pulling that out of your *** w/out doing research or knowing how it actually works.

Sorry if I seem like an *** its just how I am, just saying dont spit out false info and corrupt peoples minds that could be reading this when you have no clue what you are talking about.

Well you're right about one think, you are an ***... And this is a discussion where we are putting out ideas, so don't bash people saying there is a right and wrong, because there isn't. The only right is that it works well enough that you don't get people killed and enjoy the game. Thats it... Work on the being an *** please, for both our sakes.

Well, what Gradd said was correct.. so yeah

I consistently hit 390+ Sanguine's in my normal melee build. I honestly haven't tried gearing for it much, but I think you'll find instead of going for raw mab, you may also want to look at pieces with INT. I personally have had sanguines upwards of 600 by using every piece of +int I had in my inventory and a moldy.

As to the atonement gimp, obviously since you can't hit over 375 now, I only use sanguine (in abyssea).

Graad is only half right, yes you do loe less enmity when losing shadows rather than taking damage, however many moves hit through shadows and/or will lose them in seconds...

They are trying to encourage blood tankiong again yes.

The Enmity loss- while taking dmg on neck + head is partly to help pld hold hate while blood tanking.
People also forget when a pld takes dmg they can cure themselves, i find it easier to hold hate while blood tanking then to blink tank.
Yes i have alot of abilities and flash and cure cheat macro. But when your trying NOT to get hit, sometimes those things are hard to achieve.

Atonement damage is reduced in Abyssea? That sucks :( I don't play with any PLD when I'm in there so didn't know that.

Yeah, in abyssea I do really prefer MNK and SAM tanks to anything else. With cruor buffs and atmas you can make almost any DD/NIN a strong tank now >< FFXI is too easy mode since abyssea & cap raises.

Yes indeed there are some that can really do it. With the subs being higher level, more can be done. I'm sure a Sam can use yonnin, and innin + on top of that the wheel, to their best of their abilities.

Not saying they cannot tank, its how it can be done. Nothing is impossible, that's why the mechanics have laid it out so, so that it can be tried and tested.

I'm sure this game is now more flexable, now with the increase in caps... anything can be done.. if one wants to put their head to work and try it.

To all the derps who are one track minded.. derp derp derp.. Idiots!!!

Try to be flexable and try something new.

Yonin and Innin are NIN only.

Sounds like a good plan to me, I agree with this idea... change topic maybe? Pld/blu feelings everybody? I like the discussion lets keep it going!

***my bad.. I wa slooking at nin job too on wiki.. thank you for correcting.

just remember what draconria said...Ii made a small error so disregard the innin and yonnin. But I know that with 3rd Eye and seigan it can be possible.

SAM/NIN tank has been used a lot already so it's not exactly a "new" idea.

The use of Sam/nins and Drk/nins as tanks (and other DD jobs) is nothing new actually.

"the wheel" is not really used...and as Dracondria mentioned, you don't have access to Yonin and Innin as /nin.

You basically DD, keep shadows up, when shadows are down, you switch to PDT/MDT set where appropriate then put shadows back up once the timer is back up. Have support, haste etc.

Sam does have seigan/third eye to fall back on if necessary. DRK has some spells and abilities that can be useful for hate generation and for tanking(also stun,weaponbash,dreadspikes,and drains can be useful too, on some things), besides just building enmity through dealing damage.

Except that the higher your level, the less hate you gain from self-cure.
With good gear you should be able to achieve like 200 CE from a self-cure3.
The cap is 10000 CE.
You lose the hate you gain from that one cure in no time.
You lose 25CE when you lose 1 utsu shadow, so it's easier to maintain hate as \nin.

Sounds like a noob with no tanking experience, iunno thats just me.

Just because you WANT the game to work a certain way doesnt mean it will, Blood tanking has been tried and it doesnt work period.

Also Wtf PLD/NIN dont rely on their shield? Only haste gear? PLD/NIN RELY on their shield to get there shadows back up, but I guess you wouldnt know that having no real tanking experience. Sounds like a lazy player that doesnt gear swap, PLD/NIN is a Blink tank, it should be swapping gear like crazy. Idle in your Haste DD set, Cast Ni in full haste, Cast Ichi in a 15% Haste/Shield/fast cast Mix. Oshit Gear when Shadows are down. Flash in a Haste/Enmity Mix, Full enmity set for JA/Cures. Oh and PLD/NIN cant use PDT gear? Seriously you sound like a player from 2005 just stop while your ahead.

Pld is pretty dead tho, other jobs do much better these days, and Guess what they do it with shadows too :P

MNK/NIN is a powerful Tank so are Samurai and Dark Knight.

God you are a *** moron, there is generally always a right and wrong answer to everything in this game... If something is more efficient and works better its "right" cure bombing and letting BLM/DDs die because you are doing it wrong is "wrong". Just because you can do something doesn't make it right, thats where people generally make the mistake, and DRK tank ftw :)

Ohai boss o.o

mankey made fun of me for sam/nin >:I

Well sam/nin is good for tanking. Not the best for dealing more damage though, in comparison to other subs such as /drg or /war.

have you considered suicide as an option