Ragnarok, Still Worth Making?

99 Ukon is competitive with 99 Ragna. You probably won't get a straight answer. Some people will say 99 Ukon beats 99 Rag outside of MS/crit resist mobs. Others will say 99 Ragna is better.

I've seen a few people say that 99 Ukon beats 99 Ragna in Legion whereas thats the opposite of what happened with our Legion runs. 1 Ukon user aside, who generally always parsed in the top 3, the Ragnas were top of our parses with everything else behind (until Yoichi started being utilised). So it's probably buff/player dependent if other Legion groups are getting the opposite result.

EDIT: I should clarify most of our Ragna users were on DRK rather than WAR though.

As far as the spreadsheets go, you can get either weapon winning in just about any situation with the right kind of buffs. Outside of crit eva/def mobs or underbuffed situations, they are extremely close, the only significant advantage going to Ragnarok because its more attainable and cheaper than 99 Ukon.

I'm not saying this is correct, and I have no source other than what I've heard in my ls, but I was under the impression that all the merited weapon skills were getting nerfed from 100% stat mod to 85% mod (fully merited- 60% +5% per merit). I've never seen it in writing, but that's what I have heard others say. It's not a nerf to Ragnarok, or Resolution specifically, but a nerf to the sky high modifiers on merited weapon skills. Perhaps this is the nerf that people mentioned?

When SE says 85% mod they mean what we say when we say 100% mod, they just include the 0.85 scaling factor in the WS. If you look at the merit menu, you'll see that they specify merits increase the mod by 17% (0.85*20% = 17%).

What about the WS damage with Ragnarok? Is it more consistent then Ukko?

Ragnarok has more consistent WS numbers because Resolution is a non-crit based WS, it has more swings, and a 40% stronger STR mod.

That said, in my personal experience, Ukon pulls higher white damage.

Ah ok, I like high numbers but I favor consistent WS numbers alot more. Also I really must know, what do you mean by higher white damage? Sorry and thanks

White damage is the damage you deal during your TP phase. OT: Rag is still most definitely worth getting, and probably easier than Ukon to get with currency prices plummeting (<100m for one if you get a loan on Shiva).

White damage is a common term for melee damage. Non-WS based damage.

Resolution will spike higher, and stay more consistent, especially in zerg situations. Ukon WAR has to rely on Upheaval to compete in a zerg situation.

If you can maintain aftermath, but on virtually every parse I've done, Ragnarok wins for white damage due to the innate crit rate, fulltime (although lower activation rate) OD2.5, and generally higher x-hit builds.

My experience is the opposite Jass. In parses where I've been outparsed by a Rag WAR, I've paid particular attention and noticed that they always have higher WS numbers, but I close about half or more of the gap in white damage. High buff situations, Provenance Watcher standing out the most to my memory.

VW is an example of the first part of my statement, if you can maintain AM with Ukon it will most definately win. Prov being a time when you almost certainly will have AM3 up the entire time.

Fair enough. I'm also about eight months on hiatus still, so... it's been awhile. :P

I see, think for now ill just wait and see what SE will pull out of their butts and decide if i should make a Rag a or not. Thank you everyone for the info

the 60 billion $$ man not just buyin it outright, psh

That's long enough, sir!

I think I'll make a Ragnarok after my Amanomurakumo just to see what you kids are raving about.

I own both Ukonvasara and Ragnarok 99. I can definitely say that the great axe has higher damage potential than the greatsword. Bar mighty strikes of course.

This is especially true when you are getting crit rate buffs from either blood rage rotations with other warriors and/or rogue's roll.

The only reason I made Ragnarok for my warrior was because I actually got frustrated at all the new mobs with Crit defense/evasion SE kept pumping out. And even with the best upheaval gear I could could get my hands on for my Ukon, it just wasn't very competitive in Hal of Mul.

I would say that if you plan on getting serious about warrior, Ukonvasara should be your first priority, and build a Ragnarok later.

is upheaval better than resolution with mightystrikes up?

Resolution gets better numbers. It has a 1-hit advantage and better mod, after-all.

i suppose, i thought the attack penalty would skew that a bit though.

It'd be a rare situation for it to matter, I believe, since a WAR popping MS against high-tier targets usually involves high-tier buffs. Also, crits follow a different equation with attack, don't they?

Which comes to the question, what exactly are your buffs?

Rag + Resolution has a higher total damage potential then Ukon + Ukko but it starts with a handicap. Not only is Reso -15% attack but WAR has less GSWD skill and Rag doesn't have 20 STR (15 atk). This puts the Rag WAR behind in ratio then the Ukko WAR. Ukko can also Crit which further enhances this attack deficit.

So marginally buffed WAR (march's + food + berserk) vs difficult content will have the Ukko winning. Marginally buffed WAR vs easy content you have the Rag winning. Super buffed WAR (march's + Min + Chaos + Fighters) vs difficulty content will have them being close often with the Rag ahead by a little bit.

There is little to no reason to have both at 99, pick one and get it there. Since the OP already has a 90 Ukon and a 0 Rag I would forgo the Rag and get Ukon to 99. If the situation was reversed (95 Rag 0 Ukon) then I'd suggest getting the Rag to 99 and calling it a day.

Is it?
Using current prices from my server: Dyna currency pretty flat at 6.5 each, Marrows are about 12M, HMP at 70k and dross at 450k.

Rag 99: 98 + 60 M = 158 M
Ukon 99: 105 + 27 = 132 M

Mythbusted, Ukon 99 is cheaper, by a decent amount I may add. Almost enough to make a good body armor.

I use Uko99 for salvage/NNI/reives/Abyssea/Odin2.0 as tank and basically on anything I can't kill in 30 seconds.

I use RAG99 once every 60 minutes when Mighty Strikes is up. It is a very impressive weapon during MS. Produces the kind of numbers on resolution that are epic for outside Abyssea content.

In my experience, outside of Mighty Strikes, UKO99 pulls ahead pretty easily. However the accuracy+40 on RAG means you might do better with it on higher level content - something that the expansion has brought.

Do both. Get uko to 90, and RAG to 95. Doesn't cost any more than just getting a 75 relic.

Wiki says Reso is -8% attack. Do you got a source for the -15?

on the bg wiki it has a link to bg thread testing saying it was -15% atk if i'm not mistaken.

My memory says -15 as well going to do some research just in case.

Edit' Here's the testing done by motenten confirming the -15%.

Yes it's -15% which is why I said "it depends". If your able to hit ratio cap in WS gear then it's a beast. 4.75 fTP without DA at 100% STR on a job that gets a metric f*ck ton of STR gear is pretty insane. The weapons +14% crit rate and 16% 2.5x just makes for really nice TP damage. The down side is that without those buffs on anything worth a damn you won't be hitting cap.