Hagun....?

Ok sooo I'm terribly bored with nothing to do till my appointment so you guys are like (Wtf this guy wont leave the dam forums!)

Moving on, Related to the COR MArtial/PEacemaker Forum.

When using Martial gun.... nono when using 200% TP with or without Martial Gun WS like Slug shot, or even more duuuh Detonator the DMG difference is obvious (DMG dont include Slug acc obviously)....
So this also brings me to my next question... "Me: Hey Mr.SAM wanna merit PT?(Lol I'm also 75 SAM).
SAM: Sure.
Me: You have polearm leveled?
SAM: Polearm too weak GK onry.
Me: -_- If I out DD your SAM with my RDM using daggers I'm kicking you...
SAM: Lol....
So anyway they refuse to use Polearms sometimes and just use their lolHaguns.....Ok it will allways give +100 TP bonus..... my problem is I quiet frankly don't see the difference 9/10 times they do the same DMG as my SAM does with Onimaru, 5/10 times I out DD then with a Onimaru.....

And another thing... I also merited on my SAM with Onimaru, Engetsu, and Hagun I borrowed from a friend... Hagun made 0 difference for me... I am dead serious... I read on one Hagun page of FFxiah that SAM WS DMG is Highly dependent on TP apperantly.... unfortuanetally I have been unable to see this.... if Hagun is sooo great... why isnt the DMG constant/consistant like when a COR uses DEtonator?

Apart from Rana SAMs don't use Multi hit WS's with GK so that cannot be an excuse.... someone enlightin me please, I refuse to spend 2.5m on a GK that only works on weekends....
Your input will be greatly appreciate it... just be nice about wjhat you say ~_^ (Theres alot of arrogant *** who like to act smart so I just had to put that note in).
Thank you!!!!

You're eyeballing. If you were parsing and looked at your average gekkos, you'd see the difference.

What you are doing is what is generally termed - Eyeballing.

This is when you look at the logs and guess what you average is compared to the average of another player. And unless you are some kind of computer, you can not and will not accurately interpret the numbers into the true average.

Try parsing a fight (see our previous thread) and that will give you an exact average, and all other things being equal, a Hagun will do more than any other AH GKT during WS.

Obviously a hagun isn't going to turn a gimped sam into a good one, so if you have far better gear than the other sam then you may still beat them, but that's not the Haguns fault.

Owell, I'll do that parse check!
None the less (I feel MArtial gun is aAF@%ingmazing)
So If Hagun doesnt add a lovely chunk of DMG I feel its hardly worth that huge price =\!
But I will test it! Hell I'll test it right now maybe....

Oh and do you guys think a Hagun SAM with the exact same gear as a Engetsu SAM (Aaprt from the weapon ofcourse) would out DD the Engetsu SAM on birds o.O?

The reason Hagun is as good as everyone says is this:
DMG Multipliers @ 100/200/300 TP

In a merit pt you're generally going to be ws'ing as soon as you break the 100 TP barrier which means with Onimaru you are receiving a 1.5625 Multiplier whereas with Hagun you get bumped to the 200% Multiplier which is 1.875. Thus making Hagun the superior weapon.

The reason you might be seeing higher ws's than others may be due to you having a better ws set than the other members of the party or better food...etc.

The only way to prove it to yourself would be to parse it, i recommend getting one so you can see the differences for yourself with Hagun vs. Other GK's and also with your Martial Gun vs. Other Guns.

It does add a large chunk of damage.
18.8% increase as compared to a dmg 75 GKT. Less to a higher DMG gkt, but to do the math on that, I'd need to know your exact gear set.

No, The piercing bonus on birds destroys Hagun over time.

Polearm DoT wins as well as WS damage on birds. Even amano users use polearm in merits. Well, sometimes.

So your basically saying without the Hagun most the SAMs I've played with do 18% more trashy DMG nice, not to mention their DoT allready sux and they dont get the Onimaru DoT stats. XD!

pretty much what the two above said.

Your Melee Damage will be lowered (less acc and attack from Onimaru, plus less DMG) but your WSs will be outstanding.

You will find that WSs are the SAM's choice of damage. Not melee hits (unlike MNK or dual-wield WARs) but the actual WSs made.

There is a job called samuari. The job itself has shitty DoT. Focus on WS dmg.

This brings me to the suspicion that these SAMs can only really Epeen >_>!!!!
<- is excited to test O_O

Oh and dont worry it makes perfect sence that they mostly only worry bout WS DMG I can understand that for SAM evidently~

^ i always use as example with squid sushi at lvl20 lol.
if the person doesn't have the right gear mod for WS and/or merit you will only see like a little difference dmg but is worth the 2.5M with right gear but without it....is not worth it at all.

Sam/war with brd in pt with hagun can do in dynamis - towns and Beaucedine do great WS DMG, i do 1k - 1.6k WS but average 1.1k - 1.3k per WS(i am a taru but full merit sam and STR though since sam is my main) in those dynamis i mention

but sam/war Polearm > Hagun on birds anyday though no matter what

Going w/ my set for sample purposes



We'll say I'm on sam/war, 75 STR base
+54 from this set = 129

Mamool Ja Infiltrator has 85 VIT

129-85 = 44 + 4 = 48/4 = 12 fstr

WSC
(129 x .75) = 96, 96 x .83 = 79. 79 DMG

79 DMG + 12 DMG (fstr) + 75 DMG (hagun) = 166 DMG

79 DMG + 12 DMG (fstr) + 83 DMG (onimaru) = 174 DMG

If you're not gimp, gekko will have an ftp of 1.6625 for oni at 100% tp and 1.975 for hagun

166 x 1.975 = 327 dmg
174 x 1.6625 = 289 dmg

327/289 = 13.15% increase in WS damage.

Oni's acc and attack aren't going to make up for that much of an increase.

Oh I get it... it's like Overwhelm the more DMG your SAM< allready does, the more the Hagun contributes~

Nah, contributes the same amount percentage wise no matter where your damage is with oni.

Wait I'm confused >_>...
So if you do more DMG with your WS using a Hauby and a Hagun... the Hagun wouldnt be less effective even if you use a leather jerkin >_>?

Wait no I get it.... miss understanding...
But thats what I meant the more DMG your WS's do...
Example... if you have a Katana with DMG: 77 Only.
And consistantly did 500 DMG, let's BS and say you put on a Hagun and do 580 DMG.

Now if you change your gear and your WS's start doing 600 DMG with the blank KAtana, then your Hagun would assumingly increase it to 620-630.

Numbers don't matter much it's just an example ^^;
But that should be about right

It would be less effective compared to a hagun w/ hauby, but it would not be less effective when compared to an onimaru w/ leather jerkin

You'll do more physical damage, but the % increase will be the same.

Let's say you do 500 w/ onimaru

500 x 1.1315 = 565.75 w/ hagun


Let's say you do 1000 w/ onimaru

1000 x 1.1315 = 1131.5 w/ hagun

565.75/500 = 13.15% increase
1131.5/1000 = 13.15% increase

The % increase is the same even though the physical numbers are larger apart.

yea exactly what I meant XD
Except alot simpler!

so basically only if you ws at 300% tp with onimaru, hagun will beat it always, with the same gear set up, not counting in if double att proc. on the ws.

edit. meant if double attack proc on onimaru ws and not hagun's ws.

Vegetto, mind if I ask you something?
You're using bushinomimi over Triumph Earring for the acc purpose, or you simply don't own the triumph?

I'm asking because I have one and my WS set will look exactly like yours at 75 (except for the bushinomimi and the feet, I'm going to use Marine F Boots instead)

If ACC is the deal, I could simply use fowling earring to ws right? Or is it fine to ws on Triumph?

Just wanted to know~

I don't have triumph. Why would I? I have no use for it. As far as y/g/k, triumph > fowling

Bushi is flat better then Triumph D:

More atk, more acc and same STR, even though Acc is basically not needed on GKT WS.

On merit mobs, your acc will almost definitely be capped, so no, Fowling would not beat Triumph. No reason to buy a Triumph if you have Bushi :(

why would he use triumph if he has bushi? Bushi is like trimph+2 And it's a fulltime piece best for ws and tp.

If he had a superpunani job then yea he should gotten superpunani over bushi.

I know you weren't talking to me, I'll shut up now.

If you have ws gorget, and the 2 hand bonuses, acc shouldnt be a problem for sam ws, so like vegetto said triumph > fowling

Oh I'm sorry, I thought somehow that Bushi was STR +1, not STR+2.
But since STR is not the deciding factor as Rumaha pointed out, this is still an empty apology! =D

Anyways I got a Abyssal Earring so yeah~
and Triumph~
So triumph for ws it is~