Mnk H2H Choices

I am very new to mnk and honestly I threw a bunch of Gil at the job to get it ready so I have some gaps. When it comes to remas godhands vs verth is r15 a major game changer for either of thoes weapons performance wise. I under stand the damage is just better at r15, but it’s also my understanding that weapon skills are not where most of mnk damage comes from. Please advise.

They are completely situational. To be as basic as possible when you can skillchain you are better off with Godhands, with a few exceptions of course. Something like this month Ambu you would want Vere since you can do some insane white damage.

It is very hard to say one is better than the other honestly due to the vast differences in fights throughout the game. If you can make both then do that and use them accordingly. I personally hate making Empyreans so I use Godhdns all around and it seems to do pretty well.

^ THIS

Make whichever one is easiest/fastest first, then work on the other.

A very unpopular opinion, I'd recommend Su5 Path A. Having a very defensive based weapon which can still output competitive dps, is nice. A dead dps is a useless one. And with Su5 I think it gives you more leeway with DT and HP boost.

I would make God Hands R15 and call it a day. It's probably your most go-to weapon for almost everything.

SU5 is great for a new monk though. However, you will still feel that you want something better.

@OP is your MNK master yet?

Monk is about 30jp away from master. I got distracted and never finished grinding out the last bit of jp. I finished verth, and have the ambuscade karambit or however it’s spelled. I’m down to my last bit of Gil which is why I was looking for opinions. I can get godhands and not r15, or I can r15 verth. I hadent even thought of the su5 weapons honestly.

Out of the 2, I'd R15 Vere. But gonna go on record to say Su5, Godhands, Vere are all good choices for your future consideration.

This.

Depends how much you value parses. I have godhands, spharai, vereth on my mnks and I rarely toggle out of sagitta. Playing the entire group, the killspeed difference is not noticable and Sagitta makes for much nicer defensive sets.

Without a parse competition to put the (really, in all honesty, negligible) differences in front of you, you don't miss them.

Cool, thanks gentlemen.

Adding my own two cents here:


Verethragna
It's a fun weapon to use, but you're gonna have to rely a lot on Impetus and Aftermath.
MNK loses a lot if Impetus is lost in general, but Vere loses more than other weapons.
Mandatory to R15 this one btw.

Godhands
Difference between R1 and R15 is pretty small. I guess +30 accuracy helps, but that's it. 10% bonus to Shijin Spiral can be nice if you use it a lot, the base damage increase is a difference you'll barely notice.
Godhands is a pretty straightforward weapon. Engage, shoot WSs at the desired threshold of TP. No need to carefully plan the use of JAs, manage Afetermath etc. I mean you can do that if you want to min max, but it's not as vital as it is for Vere.
Godhands is also cheap (it's technically free) and doesn't require any particular trial or additional work.

Sagitta
Path B is close but I think Path A is the best.
It's basically a mini-verethragna with higher base damage, additional HP, DT-10%. The occasionally deals double damage is weaker than Vere's AM, but this is always active and you won't have to activate or manage an Aftermath, plus you get all the other bonuses.
Potential DPS is behind Vere of course, but Sagitta is still a pretty nice weapon.
It's not cheap, but I'd say cheaper than all the stuff you have to buy to upgrade Verethragna.
That's if you have a group that can cap your RP. If you have to buy all those Heroism Crystals then it's a different story I guess.

MNK is probably the safest DD already (beside MB drain III DRK in fight without Dispel) and what you said about Veret/Godhands negligible dps difference, can be said about Sagitta negligible defense difference. You probably feel its more useful because you 6 box (dont you?) and its probably feel better to have even marginally safer Monk when you are busy on other chars.

Also the defense edge that Sagitta gives you, can probably be easily achieved by simply using something like Defending ring for both TP and WS and DPS would probably be similar. Just checked in sheet and R15 Godhands vs Sagitta A, with Impetus down and using Howling Fist, Godhands has still slightly higher DPS even when you take off Gere ring completely during TP and WS.

EDIT: For Impetus UP and Victory Smite spam, with R15 Veret you can have empty ring, earring and ammo slots during TP and WS and still come on top of SagittaA. So you could full time Defending ring, Odnowa earring R15 and Staunch (which is much more defensive values than SagittaA offers over other weapons) with VeretR15 and still have higher DPS.

Not saying you're wrong, but I don't just wear Sagitta, I wear a hybrid set with 75 SBII, 50 DT(not PDT). I haven't looked at the options to accomplish that with godhands/vereth recently, but they were pretty crippling last time I did. You also gain the 150 HP off sagitta.

Obviously, if you don't have to give up any of the defensive value, then it's better to use godhands/vereth. If you have a set like that, I'd be interested to see the DPS difference.

Godhands also gets 24 base damage at R15, that's not really small.

You've got a lot of options. I have both vere and GH at R15 and I get tons of use out of both, sometimes in the same fight. Like others have said, without impetus stacks vere really shits the bed but is relatively unmatched in terms of raw output when you can keep stacks up. GH I use in every other situation, they're just so consistent.

I don't have Sagitta as I don't really feel the pressing need to get more defensive than my hybrid set but I can definitely see the benefits. It's hard to go wrong with monk these days, just don't trade your Sagitta to Odoro if you go that route.

All damage differences are pretty small when taking a results-based approach to the game. The safer option is essentially always better, xi players just obsess over DPS and parse totals.

I have both Vere & GHs .. I would recommend getting GHs, as its free and versatile. If you love MNK then set a long term goal getting Vere, its really great under impetus.

I was replying to sechs about r1 to 15 regarding godhands. If you like the SU5 that's fine but I don't see a point in it personally. I'm already ridiculously tanky in my hybrid set with basically zero cost to dps and capped sb in both tp and ws set. It honestly doesn't matter at this point. If the extra hp is what saves you at any point I guess it wins there.

Yeah but Sagitta is like 94m, I'd invest in either an Empy or Aeonic for mnk.. TK or RF with fighter's roll and GHs is ridiculously devastating

The Su5 is always a hard sell, it's as expensive as, but not as good as other options

If the aug was free (dyna kills/exp), or no *** aug in the first place. ABC would just be ON the weapon. then maybe it'd be less bullshitty

(Heroism has come down now it's only like 40m for the aug I guess)But Still 100+40 for it, or you can R15 the Aeonic for 30+90 It's an easy choice... Plus you have to already be mastered to use it. You can pick up R15 GH from 0JP.

GH Vere Sagitta are all fugly. Get spharai.

According to the spreadsheet the difference is quite minimal, as it's the case with the majority of R15 Aeonic to be fair.

Test it yourself and check numbers.

If I recall it's like ~350 dps difference. Of course this number will differ according to the spreadsheet, but I remember it was quite disappointing.
Talking about the base damage difference only of course, it's another story for the other boons (Acc and Shijin dmg)

Post your set then please, because I would rather not guess what are you using and without knowing it, I cant really try to change it and compare DPS. You have hybrid set in your Item Sets, but its not 50%DT and not 75% SB, so I guess its not that one.

I also disagree on "The safer option is essentially always better". Its only better when survivability gain is actually needed to survive. Every bit of survivability you have above the threshold you need to survive is essentially wasted. The best build would be something that has ideal balance of required survivability while keeping highest possible DPS. You can say that XI players are obsessed with DPS, but from what you are saying, I could conclude you are a little obsessed with survivability.

Its around 5% of raw DPS with non Shijin WS being used. Not sure why thats disappointing tho. The only change for raw damage between R0 and R15 is adding ~8.5% more base damage (with neutral fSTR, its even less with positive fSTR) and thats obviously even less increase for white damage (because kicks are part of it and they doesnt go up with higher damage weapon, unless under footwork) and even less for WS damage, because WS damage is made also from WSC. So "disappointing" is probably wrong word here because its perfectly expected. Imo 30acc, macc and 10% to Shijin are totally worth it tho.

Can somone please explain to me how weaponskill mods contribute to weapon damage? By reading the page on bg it looks like it adds a % of the mod to the base damage of a weapon. So my understanding is that to get 24 base damage from a mod you would need something like 30 str on an 80% mod, but from what you guys are saying it looks like it is not that valuable.

Either way I agree maxing out godhands is totally worth it and I can't say the same for most weapons. Look at Aeneas for example. Few base damage and acc for jobs that have a ton of acc already and a bonus to a garbage ws.

You understand correctly.

Little known fact: If your Su5 is signed by someone you know (or yourself) there is hidden +50 base damage.

But afaik, augmenting it gonna wipe off the signature